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Why don't we all just bail on the organization for a year and then expect it to still be there when normal life returns? We're buying $10,000 - $20,000 machines. Why are we concerned about risking $200 on a season we all want? If it's a total wash bitch after the fact and I'm sure something will happen at that point (never a full refund, but something more than this). In the interim buy your pass and give the organization the re-assurance it needs to get on with planning for this season. Last time I checked new groomers were already being bought and some deliveries have occured with more to come. Like it or not there is fixed costs to be paid to keep this ship moving forward.

I think the big difference is the geography between the two provinces. Montreal is as far north as Huntsville. Quebec City is comparable to North Bay. You essentially have two major cities that are living in the snow belt. Those riders can be in good snow within a very close drive. They also can be at exceptional destinations in 5 hours or less. From Montreal Gaspe, Saguenay and Abitibi are all only 5 hours away. The laurentians, Lanauduere and Chaudiere are all less than 2 hours from home. There is inheritantly more value to these populations as opposed to someone in Toronto that is only in North Bay or Sudbury with a 4 - 5 hour trip (great riding, but not as good as Gaspe or Abitibi). The algonquin highlands are a 2 hour drive from the GTA which is great sledding, but it's definately a shorter season than Lanaudiere. I don't think the OFSC is doomed. It's arguable that district 5 is in trouble unless there is some technology changes (can we come up with a way to preserve the snow we get or make artificial snow???). The OFSC is arguably making much better use of resources compared to Quebec on a dollar by dollar basis. That said there's no denying that Quebec is delivering more grooming, better signage and a longer season due to the geographic advantages it has. They are probably attaining and spending 30% or more cash each season compared to Ontario so it's no wonder there is differences. Here's hoping we see permit sales increase in Ontario this winter. I personally haven't met anyone yet that bought permits last season that said they won't buy this year due to covid. This could work out very well for the sport in Ontario.

Trail work is starting up and I can't wait to get out and prep the trails for this season. September 1st early bird is a bonus for me, I have a lot of empties to return from the past 6 mths, permit or more beer? Most of us on here are diehards, volunteers. There will be riding this winter, if Covid rears its ugly head, I think as a Province we are better prepared for it. It may just mean closer to home for most of us.

Sorry to read this formerly known as IQ Turbo - Doo. Your sledding pursuits are different than mine, but could always find some common ground. Hope you are back once the season starts, find joy in the riding and maybe not so much in the equipment. I also recently split the forum for a while to spend more time with my family....... help out with the family businesses ......and stepped down from the OC Forum to make room for more diverse voices ...... hoping for a replacement that was Black, Indigenous or a person of colour. I have come to recognize that my privilege has benefited me greatly. And while I have certainly worked hard and contributed much to this forum, I know that systemic racism and injustice helps people like me, and harms those who aren’t like me often in ways that are invisible to me and us. This needs to change..... Full disclosure - spent 3 years 288 days in an Indian community. (The North American Indian type...the First Nations Industry was very goood to me) As for the future, the CRA, anticipating "problems" with CERB and other giveaway's claimants, may be presenting contract positions as audit assistants, and having been an accounting instructor for several years, as well as having "a superior knowledge of Canadian regionalities", (their words...all that earlier travelling I did job seeking pays off again) might keep me off the streets. You can check qualifications for positions on their web site. Having recently retired, I'm not too inclined to begin yet another (fourth) career, but the tax cheat stories told by my recently retired chartered accountant with the CRA brother in law, make the job seem very interesting. I remember this guy in Yellowknife who used to drive his car to Edmonton, rent a similar model, take both to his brother in law's farm and begin swapping parts. He began swapping wives back in YK - getting away with one crime encouraged him to try others including tax fraud.....and wife turned him in both to the cops and Revenue Canada as it was known then. Poor bastard didn't know what hit him You do not have to send in receipts, but save them as the CRA may request them later dot dot dot Also begun the ground work for a registered tax credit charity called D.D.D.G. - Disgraced Despondent Do Gooders - got the Kielburgers lined up as well as a few others.....just waiting for a few more charities to fold so that better ribbon colours become available....currently all the good ones are taken.

Ordered 13 permits last week, very easy, no problems. I ordered 13 permits, one for myself and one for each of the dozen club members that don't have/use computers, therefore they don't have email addys. Two of the members don't have or use credit cards, so I pay for them with my card and they reimburse me.

Do you also think insurance should give you a rebate? What about all the costs you spent on a preseason service? The permit is the cheapest part of anything I spend on a year worth of snowmobiling.

The 50 permit requirement was eliminated last year. With the change to the funding model last year, there is no direct financial advantage to a club/district to selling more permits, other than there is more money in the pot to share. District and clubs are funded based on their km of trails, hours groomed and an Admin allowance which is determined by the BoG. The system is not without its problems but in general it works better than the old matrix. By better, I mean the money tends to follow the snow and does not get hoarded in bank accounts.

The Laake Conestoga club did a stellar job of rerouting ssome of their trails off GRCA land last year and I'm sure will do it and more again this year. Negativity will not help as much as volunteering would.

Folks are gonna love my BV2S helmet this winter. Frozen 'air' dripping from the mouthpiece..... Burn the witch, they said, upon entry.

Rather than hijack the other thread, I figured I'd start a new 1. In 2018 SJ, irREVerent & I did 4 days of riding out of Timmins. It wasn't the 'perfect' ride in 4 different directions, but it was close. From there you can ride: West to Foleyet for lunch & fuel South to Gogama (T-C-P) for lunch. I think Nunz & Mrs Nunz planned to loop thru Shining Tree but the mileage is a bit much for the terrain/trails North to Cochrane This can be done either as an out & back or 3 different loops (via SRF & back A106C, via Iroquois Falls & back A106C, via SRF and IF) East to Matheson (lunch @ Northern Delight Restaurant) This ride is weather dependent due to the road running west of Val Gagne.

Another hub location that I like is Kapuskasing. It is a further drive, but from there you can easily ride the many Moonbeam loops, day ride to Cochrane for lunch, day ride to Hearst for lunch via L123 and L151? and return on A. I have based there a few times, particularly at end of season.. Kap also has a number of restaurants that deliver or are cab accessible. The delivery might be more important this year with the reduced seating in the restaurants. When I go to a hub, I always have a set of plates and cutlery in the truck for take out foods. Like I said, it is a longer drive, 1.5 hours past Cochrane, but well worth it. IMO.

sorry turbo doo left us but, i understand sometimes the forums get to us. hopefully, he returns, recharged. with that said, i think everyone in the sledding community is going to be in for a RUDE AWAKENING, when the season starts. there is no way businesses are going to let us in with wet, frozen, dripping balaclavas, gloves, etc... then let us hang them, or place them on a register to warm/dry out. there are going to be A LOT OF NEW RULES. i am guessing they will start with, you need to leave your contaminated clothing items outside on your sled, to avoid cross contamination. that will be THE START, of the rules. good luck to us all, the virus isnt going away, obviously we cant stop it. Ski

Hey Steve hope all is good with you and the fam. We stopped saddle bagging and started hubbing out of one place a few years ago, after getting tired of keeping a pace. Great chance to check out all the local trails and loops, and other local attractions you passed right on by trying to make it on time to your next destination before dark. We've been using New Liskeard as a hub at least once a season for the past 3 years. Lots of good long and short day options out of there and/or Kirkland Lake. Even the ride out to Gowganda and back with a little change up coming back into town is a great day of riding. We usually just stay at the Quality Inn for convenience, but lots of options for what your looking for in the surrounding area.

There are costs that need to get paid on a yearly basis, even if trails don’t open. Ofsc has held permit price steady for last few seasons. I will buy my permit early this year and even if I only get a few weekends in, that is ok. Covid is not ofsc’s fault either and I am sure they are encouring some extra costs because of it too. So let’s support them and hope trails can stay open for as long as Mother Nature allows them. Cheers and if it does get shut down, I would be in favour of donating 50 bucks towards land owner relations for a change. Anything to improve rider experience and keep local trails accessible.

If the club can't make it work, I'm pretty sure that the local clubs, OFSC and the businesses that benefit from what has been a very successful tour loop will make the RAP tour possible.

I would say correct from my understanding. If a system wide shut down happens before Feb 16, then you get a credit towards next year. Trails stay open one day longer, and no credit next year.

Will be buying 2 permits as usual early early to be part of any benefit program trails are gonna be open this year and did we hear what the Farmers Almanac has called for ?

just like every yr, i'll bitch a little but still end up buying my permit. ohhhhh the pain

Blake, the motion you refer to was to take the Classic from 15 years to 20. The way it got worded however, the Classic is frozen at 1999 model years and older indefinitely. It’s too late for this season but it would take a member to move an amendment to the 2022 Permit Recommendation at the AGM , that the qualifier year be set at 20 (or 25) model years or older. The push back has always been that there are too many model year 2000/2001 sleds still in active use and the revenue hit is too big.

Most hotels and motels will have adapted to the new norm for service by this winter. That or they are out of business. Dont expect cheap one night accommodations. Most hotels now leave rooms empty for at least 48 hours before entering to clean. And no cleaning services during your stay. Just get extra towels or dump garbage yourself. If business travellers can do it no reason snowmobilers cannot.

Hope it is a great one buddy! Ski

Well said. I will buy passes for my four sleds early and hope for a good season.

https://www.kijiji.ca/v-vacation-rentals-ontario/calabogie-lake-5-bedroom-cottage-safe-secluded-fall-dates/1524698652?undefined Place in Calabogie

That has been eliminated this year.

I put this rack on my sled that is for a Grand Touring, and I really like it! I just toss an ATV bag in and go. The bag isn't tied down, it just fits like a glove, but I doo have bungees holding the shovel on, so ... I got new aftermarket muffs as well as my old (and I mean OLD!) Doo muffs were long wasted. I wouldn't want these for trail riding tho I don't think. These light weight ones like to blow up off your hands, but for what we doo - they are the cats meow. I have a set of the old, real heavy muffs with the wool (?) inside that go quite a ways up your fore-arm, and are plenty stiff to not move an inch, but those don't go off-trail werth a hoot. Still sporting the 1990's Doo tank bag. Is there anything out there that is anywhere near what that is these days? Oh yeah, my '90's helmet too. LOL! I hated the newer ones that I tried on. So I stock up on the model that I like whenever one the right size and condition come up on ebay. I would really like to build a perminent gas tank on this yet, but just not gotten a plan together that I liked yet, so I just toss a 2 gal jerry on the back and go, but it's not that nice...

Have fun! Waking up to the sweet smell of someone emptying "black water" not the best way to start the day! Just happened to be there one day checking out the place and this occurred. Made a note of it in my "vacation" files. BTW - just for fun, here is a link to the trans-Newfoundland ATV tour in case you need something else to add to your bucket list: https://www.crossingnewfoundlandbyatv.com The guy provides a printable day by day tour book and a map which will open in the free version of Locus. (you also get 3 free maps with Locus) Something to kick around with your gang when you get back in the evening.

Sold.

Not sure if you saw this last winter. More opportunities that what I rode. Signage in the Westmeath area a bit sketchy, (ask irREVerent). L127 is road running so I wouldn't have it planned as part of a loop. Best Western is right beside the Holiday Inn and Irving Big Stop is across the road. Lots of parking.

Concur 100%. Two good motels with decent prices with park out your door access and a couple of better hotels for nicer if required. Here's a list of what's in our "motel box" which might be helpful: We squeeze all this into a plastic tub with snap lid - 17.5 inches wide, 23 inches long 15 inches high. -1 liter kettle -full size coffee maker (those ones supplied aren't worth the bother to even fill)&filters -toaster (operate in such a way not to set off smoke alarm) -2 melmac plates (the green camping ones of your youth, microwave safe and won't break if dropped) -2 melmac bowls -2 forks, 2 spoons, 1 butter knife, 1 paring knife, fish filleting knife for the tougher things to cut (or for cleaning fish) -2 large stainless steel tall mugs (usually kept in the truck for coffee stops along the way) -2 plastic stacking cups -can opener -wine bottle opener -the above is kept in a plastic milk bag pouring container.(usually carry milk in emptied plastic juice bottles - Ocean Spray bottles are the best for durability - milk and juice can be frozen ahead of time for keeping your cooler cool while in the room. As for ice, best thing to use is wide mouth spagetti sauce bottles (Ragu RIP) as you can refill them from a motel ice cube machine. -various extension cords and multi connectors (older motel wiring inadequate, helps set up applicances, chargers, laptops etc.) Enables shutting off some things to use kettle or coffee maker without blowing a fuse. -jar of peanut butter, small tub margarine, small tub honey (won't spoil without refridgeration, thaws out well if frozen in vehicle) -use empty plastic peanut butter jars ...kraft or skippy's...hold sugar for coffee, tea bags, ground coffee PRO TIP - at home prior to your trip, get 1 kg container of Melitta coffee (sale price 12.97) and 1 bag of strong ground starbucks.(sale price 7.99) Mix well in a ratio of 1 bag to 1 can and put in peanut butter jars with a plastic coffee measure spoon. One spoon full per cup in the basket plus one for the pot. You'll get some premium tasting coffee to get your day off to a good start. -lipton cup of soup various flavours although chicken seems the best - good with a sandwich -Via instant coffee packs - tastes almost like fresh brewed for those afternoon pickup after a nap. -small packets of condiments, salt and pepper shakers -use a couple of snap lid tupperware to hold some of the stuff - comes in handy for left over delivery pizza, chinese food etc. -small container dish soap (also works as shampoo if revrnd finds no bath products in room) quick dry towel and wash cloth. -roll of saran wrap. -also have a small microwave if none is supplied with room. Inside keep oven mitts, stir spoon, cardboard shield for glass rotating dish -a couple of tins of condensed milk will keep forever if not opened or for several days if opened and covered - beats the powder coffee creamer. A couple of other things to keep in the truck if you find yourself stranded in an area in which the hydro is out: -coleman camp stove and fuel -fry pan and a couple of pots to boil water and warm food -camp lamp - naptha fuel -at least 2 full 20 liter gas cans and a siphon to drain the sleds for the truck- no pumps will be working. See if anyone else can add some more ideas either here or somewhere else. If I think of anything further, I'll add it later. -forget pyrex casserole dish in motel box - put small items in it when packing - can be used for microwave cooking kraft dinner etc.

I guess you are talking about restaurants? Motels/hotels should be ok. First, put your luggage in the bathtub and check for bedbugs. If ok, you'll need a can of Lysol or other spray, or the Lysol wipes and start wiping things down - light switches, toilet flush handle, fawcetts, the TV remote, thermostat, flat surfaces, anything you might contact with your hands or face. Regards spray or wipes, make darn sure they specify they kill VIRUSES, not just germs or bacteria. Some don't. Minimum 70% isopropyl will also work - about the same strength as that in gas line antifreeze if you're stuck. And who doesn't like the aroma of that? If possible, bring your own sleeping bag and pillow. Make sure you've got a few disposable masks to enable entry into the establishment in the first place. The food situation can be tragic in some cases. While self-isolating in Quebec last March, we were forced by threat of covid to avoid the traditional sugar shack brunch. Read the offerings and weep with me: Included: - Traditional Quebec music during the brunch - Maple taffy on snow - Horse drawn sleigh rides Menu of our Sugar Shack brunch: - Pea soup - Pork rinds - Bacon - Sausages - Homemade ham cooked with rosemary & maple syrup from our sugar shack - Gabrielle potato cooked with duck fat & rosemary - Scrambled eggs with onions, peppers, chives and swiss cheese - Baked beans - Meat pie - Green salad & dressing made with maple syrup from our sugar shack - Plate of cheeses from our region - Toasts & homemade jam - Cereal & milk - Fresh fruit platter - Pancakes with maple syrup from our sugar shack - Pouding chômeur - Coffee Which reminds me - regards the log cabin thread somewhere, best you don't paint your inside log walls. Noted. I will use it to heat up a few large rocks, shut it down, and enter when safe to do so. Hopefully I will not be appropriating anyone's culture - learned at the Huron Indian Village in Midland that is how they used to boil water and stoke up the sweat lodge - obviously with a fire of course, not a barbeque. .......Hmmm....now if I threw a bit of water or snow on those rocks.....skidooboy is saying we might just have to leave our clothes outside....

Good point, Ski. We're looking at 'base' style trips. Out all day, lunch on trail, back to base. Of course, if restaurants figure out some way to accommodate us, glad to support them. Might involve modified take-out, some type of shelter outside (not kidding...Dock Lunch in Penetang comes to mind...wooden-lean to with tarps ...although they have inside in winter. Picture the wooden awning outside, with perhaps a portable heat supply in the way-way north on a cold day). Mad Max snowmobiling...here we come. Also going to miss Turbo Doo, btw. Never read the tipping point post or saw it coming. Like many, really enjoyed his writing. Definitely enjoyed the riding, comradery. In my best Arnold Sz. voice - 'he''l be baaaaack' (I hope).

No problem! Another idea.... As a landowner in Newfoundland (needed to get in) I am also considering a two week quarantine on the west coast of the province in an airbnb special. There is usually 7 or 8 feet of snow there just before the pagan holiday of Christmas.

Here's a good example of what you could use - an unlocked smart phone ...unlocked means you can take it to any cell phone provider and use it on their system if you want. This one on Amazon.ca. Nice big screen -measured diagonally. Works great as stand alone for a variety of things: -phone accesses a cellular network OR wifi available in most places -you can get a 20 gigabyte month data plan from the major providers, although you don't have to. Should you do something like this, your phone can be used as a "hot spot" enabling you to have internet access on wirelessly connected PCs. I successfully ran 3 on line courses using the cell phone hotspot and a pc with about 2 bars or less of 4g and 3g cell signal without any overages once courses were set up. -wifi is available at most commercial outlets and stores, libraries etc. -using the Android model (instead of Apple phone) you access the google play store and download the applications you want. These could include the many snowmobiling maps - local and provincial - as well as movies, library books, all kinds of stuff. I can honestly say it has changed my life much for the better having access. -I bought two of the umidigi phones on sale - umidigi one model- use one as a phone, the other for utilities such as reading downloaded books (free with a local library membership and access to libby) watching cbc gem, tubi, etc. from wifi sources in hotels etc. -after purchase, at walmart they sell two stylus's (stylii?) for $3 in case you have large stumbling fingers, as do I. Recommended. -for the Quebe Imotoneigh maps, you download the app on wifi (or cell) and it shows the trail system and a lot more information. On the trail, the phone's gps will show you where you are located, gas, hotels, etc. whether you are on line or not. (keep the phone warm) Recently purchased an android tablet as well - price at the time was $145.00 - neat thing about it is the hdmi output so you can stream from tablet to larger screen tv. Pretty reliable and useful so far: Download such free apps as "Here We Go" and you've got yourself a guided navigation application for all of Canada, the US, or other world destinations. Works great. Telus (on same towers as Bell) has 20 gibabytes currently for $75 per month + tax - unlimited texts, long distance and local calling, data still works although slower after you use up your 20 gigabytes. Likely the other carriers have the same deal - find that Bell/Telus has better coverage than Rogers. Just bring your smart phone to a local outlet, they will supply and install the SIM card for you. You can do this online as well, but for a beginner, worth the extra cost I think.

Have you ridden the loop you are suggesting?

I think he wants to be in one place, not saddle bagging.

http://gowgandalakelodge.com great place and location for snowmobiling. Can loop up to Cochrane or south to Sudbury. A few loops you can do. They have gas and home cooked meals for thier guests.

Well, it looks like he's Done....

Still illegal just like your your last idea. Sled clubs are trying to do it legally. I'm done with this now. Bye Bye.

If you have any doubt about the season not opening then you can wait to buy your permit until after it happens. Your choice, its a gamble like many other things in our lives.

I think you only get the $50.00 off if the OFSC has to close the trails early this winter. At least that's what I took from my reading it anyway.

Sorry guys. Ontario sledding is going to suck balls this year because I just bought 2 OFSC permits.

Purchased as well. Yup lots of big words that I skipped over and checked the box's. But I fully understand if anything goes south, its my fault and the clubs, OFSC and the landowners are not responsible.

The OFSC should take a lesson from Quebec with regards to permit pricing.

Ill be buying 2 permits as well. Same as every other year.

If I recall correctly, the volunteers running the organization made the decision at the AGM two or three years ago to change from a 20 year to a 25 year requirement for the Classic Trail Pass. This requires a five year phase-in period.

I've always found that the trail permit was the least of all my sledding costs ..... a fixed cost of $190 is nothing really IMO just add up the cost cost of gong away sledding for a weekend, gas for your truck, cocktails, meals, more beer, lodging, & yea more beer + misc expenses +++ cheers

Well said and thanks, I totally agree, The answer I did get yesterday in response to a question that was asked is, There will not be refunds of trail passes in the event that trails do not open, There is a ton of expenses that are spent long before the trails even open as we all know. I will be buying our two trail passes and likely Quebec passes this winter in some form and make the best of what happens.

Thanks guys!!! Much appreciated. Looking forward to a fun weekend on the boat, I think we are heading towards Port Severn tomorrow.

I would like to see that at 6pm when it is -25C.