Not good!

[stoney]

13 minutes ago, SRXChris said:

.  Is property private ?  Do they patrol; the whole forest or the prescribed OFSC trail within it's limits?   Seems odd to waste taxpayer money patrolling private property.

 

Yes, private.

I have only ever seen them on the main trail - but they could be anywhere as they are paid by HF to be there.

HF started hiring them to curve the accidents and recklessness of people - used be a guy dressed in a Orange snow suit that patrolled it (pumpkin).

[Spiderman]

37 minutes ago, stoney said:

 

 

I know for sure Odot1 was asked this on other forums - I do not recall the answer, but, assumption would be trail on sanctioned road falls under HTA......hence why kids with sled license are not suppose to ride sled on trail that crosses road or runs on road.

Well, that's important to note.

If you're going to speed - do it on a trail lol

would be very easy to get a big ticket with points on some stretches of road where the trails are on them. 

[Strong Farmer]

5 hours ago, PISTON LAKE CRUISER said:

Do you know for sure that the HF is paying the police or is that something you heard?

Yes they are paid by forest. Lady at base camp told me they invite them in to do random blitz’s based on traffic. 

[Spiderman]

4 minutes ago, Strong Farmer said:

Yes they are paid by forest. Lady at base camp told me they invite them in to do random blitz’s based on traffic. 

"Invite" - or are paid?

 

To me, those are 2 different things

[stoney]

40 minutes ago, Spiderman said:

"Invite" - or are paid?

 

To me, those are 2 different things

 

I have always been told paid - but could be an interesting argument.

Maybe if the OFSC starts to pay for OPP enforcement, we would get a better service......

[stonehaven]

The OPP are not paid by the Forest to come in, however they welcome to patrol anytime.  They have already been in there twice this season.  

[manotickmike]

1 hour ago, SRXChris said:

I'm curious as well.

Hence my comment. Thanks, Spiderman.

Parking lots terrify me. I drove field service for 25 years. 

You can pretty much get away with murder in a parking lot. 

Trusting someone to apply road rules there will get you in big trouble. The stop signs are meaningless. 

I was T-boned in a company vehicle by an idiot in a parking lot, despite my heightened alertness. 

It took our lawyers and insurance companies well over a year to get it sorted, all the while someone or other was giving me the stink-eye. 

Commercial insurance is expensive. One good claim can get your whole fleet policy cancelled.

I had to hire my own lawyer just to get my own head-office A-holes off my case.

They wanted to dismiss me, and I refused to drive until they got their collective s#it together.

 

 

[Spiderman]

1 hour ago, stonehaven said:

The OPP are not paid by the Forest to come in, however they welcome to patrol anytime.  They have already been in there twice this season.  

That makes way more sense

[tricky]

 

7 hours ago, stonehaven said:

The OPP are not paid by the Forest to come in, however they welcome to patrol anytime.  They have already been in there twice this season.  

 

6 hours ago, Spiderman said:

That makes way more sense

 So you don't believe the Haliburton Forest Facebook comment that they use paid duty OPP to police their trails? OFTR/SCORRA use paid duty OPP to police their trails. Makes some sense to me that Haliburton Forest would budget for some police patrols.

[stonehaven]

8 hours ago, tricky said:

 

 

 So you don't believe the Haliburton Forest Facebook comment that they use paid duty OPP to police their trails? OFTR/SCORRA use paid duty OPP to police their trails. Makes some sense to me that Haliburton Forest would budget for some police patrols.

I'm just going by what some of the people that work there told me.  I asked one guy again yesterday and he told me they don't pay them.  Also said might see them in there more often until OFSC trails open up

[stonehaven]

Regardless if they are paid or not, he gives me a heads up when they are patrolling in the Forest. 😁

[Spiderman]

9 hours ago, tricky said:

 

 

 So you don't believe the Haliburton Forest Facebook comment that they use paid duty OPP to police their trails? OFTR/SCORRA use paid duty OPP to police their trails. Makes some sense to me that Haliburton Forest would budget for some police patrols.

Well, people can say anything they want - I would probably say the same thing in an effort to keep people honest.

I would also welcome them in, it's a win win

We have an area in my city that "paid" duty are used - it's not voluntary - it's forced on the business owners via a levy as part of their licences - it's very very expensive.

I wouldn't want to see the bill for having two Paid Duty OPP's riding around for the day - but maybe for them it's worth it to keep people in check.

 

 

[PISTON LAKE CRUISER]

Thanks to the gentleman that sent the following definition of "Trail" as used in the MSVA.:

 

Definition of Trail in section 1 of the MSVA.

“trail” means the whole of any trail established and maintained by a recreational organization for the use of motorized snow vehicles; (“piste”)

 

I think that the above definition would apply to the H.F. even though they are a for profit org. 

 

One thing that stands out for me in the news report is that the headline that indicates the radar stop took place on an OFSC trail. If that is indeed the case, there are no OFSC trails open in that area and so there should have been trespassing charges laid.

[stoney]

5 minutes ago, PISTON LAKE CRUISER said:

Thanks to the gentleman that sent the following definition of "Trail" as used in the MSVA.:

 

Definition of Trail in section 1 of the MSVA.

“trail” means the whole of any trail established and maintained by a recreational organization for the use of motorized snow vehicles; (“piste”)

 

I think that the above definition would apply to the H.F. even though they are a for profit org. 

 

One thing that stands out for me in the news report is that the headline that indicates the radar stop took place on an OFSC trail. If that is indeed the case, there are no OFSC trails open in that area and so there should have been trespassing charges laid.

 

Well we all know, or should know.....90% of the info reported my media is incorrect.

 

How many time have you either been at an event or have direct inside knowledge of an event to hear the media report something that makes you shake your head and wonder where they were that they saw this....

[zoso]

This is toronto paid duty rate. No doubt opp on sleds would be more.

Paid Duty Rate Increase

Please note starting January 1, 2022, the hourly rates are increasing!

Police Constables (all classifications)	$78.50 (minimum $235.50)
Sergeants (when in charge of 4 or more police officers)	$89.00 (minimum $267.00)
Staff Sergeant (when in charge of 10 or more police officers)	$98.00 (minimum $294.00

[Spiderman]

18 minutes ago, PISTON LAKE CRUISER said:

Thanks to the gentleman that sent the following definition of "Trail" as used in the MSVA.:

 

Definition of Trail in section 1 of the MSVA.

“trail” means the whole of any trail established and maintained by a recreational organization for the use of motorized snow vehicles; (“piste”)

 

I think that the above definition would apply to the H.F. even though they are a for profit org. 

 

One thing that stands out for me in the news report is that the headline that indicates the radar stop took place on an OFSC trail. If that is indeed the case, there are no OFSC trails open in that area and so there should have been trespassing charges laid.

 

The article says "in Haliburton Forest" - which are NOT OFSC prescribed trails.

The MSVA does not apply to private property

 

 

 

[PISTON LAKE CRUISER]

4 minutes ago, Spiderman said:

 

The article says "in Haliburton Forest" - which are NOT OFSC prescribed trails.

The MSVA does not apply to private property

 

 

 

There are OFSC prescribed trails on the Halibuton Forest property. As well, many of the OFSC trails in Ontario are on private property annd the MSVA apply to them.

[stoney]

3 minutes ago, PISTON LAKE CRUISER said:

There are OFSC prescribed trails on the Halibuton Forest property.

Yes, OFSC trail passes through from K to little Red, but I doubt there was a sled clocked at 120KM on that section based on what I recall that trail was like.....likely down the main road out of base camp.

And 120km may sound like a lot, but a sled gets up to that in the blink of an eye that we all know the vast majority of usually are not that far off that mark on a straight section of trail.

[Spiderman]

25 minutes ago, PISTON LAKE CRUISER said:

There are OFSC prescribed trails on the Halibuton Forest property. As well, many of the OFSC trails in Ontario are on private property annd the MSVA apply to them.

 

I didn't know there were OFSC prescribed trails in the Haliburton Forest.

Sorry, to clarify, MSVA applies to OFSC prescribed trails only

 

[Spiderman]

20 minutes ago, stoney said:

Yes, OFSC trail passes through from K to little Red, but I doubt there was a sled clocked at 120KM on that section based on what I recall that trail was like.....likely down the main road out of base camp.

And 120km may sound like a lot, but a sled gets up to that in the blink of an eye that we all know the vast majority of usually are not that far off that mark on a straight section of trail.

yeah, that's about 75 miles an hour - doesn't take long to hit that at all.

 

[infernobuster]

Just an FYI. The HTA was changed in Sept of last year to include all private entities as well. 

 

ie parking lots etc.  I dont think that includes snowmobile trails with the exception of road running, or alongside a highway. Again, up to officer interpretation.

[Spiderman]

49 minutes ago, infernobuster said:

Just an FYI. The HTA was changed in Sept of last year to include all private entities as well. 

 

ie parking lots etc.  I dont think that includes snowmobile trails with the exception of road running, or alongside a highway. Again, up to officer interpretation.

Yup, saw that - the change followed the ruling on the case I posted.

 

 

[UsedtoSkidoo]

It wouldnt include a private driveway for a single dwellling

[Nutter]

4 hours ago, Spiderman said:

 

I didn't know there were OFSC prescribed trails in the Haliburton Forest.

Sorry, to clarify, MSVA applies to OFSC prescribed trails only

 

 

 

The MSVA applies to anywhere public including lakes, crown and municipal land, and on private land where the public is invited to ride by fee, and/or if enforcement is requested by the land owner, however on roads and hwy's it's up to the discretion of the officer to enforce under the HTA or MSVA. I was made aware of this from ride alongs with Sean (ODot1) 

[Spiderman]

9 minutes ago, Nutter said:

 

 

The MSVA applies to anywhere public including lakes, crown and municipal land, and on private land where the public is invited to ride by fee, and/or if enforcement is requested by the land owner, however on roads and hwy's it's up to the discretion of the officer to enforce under the HTA or MSVA. I was made aware of this from ride alongs with Sean (ODot1) 

Appreciate the clarification 

Cheers