sledjunk Posted September 23, 2012 Author Share Posted September 23, 2012 I was talking to some ofsc reps from district 5 today at plowing match. They told me last year district 5 alone accounted for 25000 seasonal permits. Rumor has it only 80 percent of people in district 5 are going to re purchase. That could be a whooping 5000 permit drop, if this does occur. Alot of people I talk too, say they are waiting for the snow before they plunk down the permit money. Going to be a tough year for Ontario, if we don't get early snow. As I read them, the figures from the OFSC reconciliation show D5 sales as 9192, not 25000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dweese Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 You are mistaken, we do not pay for val tags on sleds in the North, and we pay 1/2 price for car stickers and no e-tests. Foiled again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbakernbay Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 I was talking to some ofsc reps from district 5 today at plowing match. They told me last year district 5 alone accounted for 25000 seasonal permits. Rumor has it only 80 percent of people in district 5 are going to re purchase. That could be a whooping 5000 permit drop, if this does occur. Alot of people I talk too, say they are waiting for the snow before they plunk down the permit money. Going to be a tough year for Ontario, if we don't get early snow. "Rumour has it only 80% of people are going to repurchase ........" Who in their right mind can make this statement as being anything close to being factual? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreezerBurnt Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 As I read them, the figures from the OFSC reconciliation show D5 sales as 9192, not 25000. Thanx for showing the real numbers not number pulled out of the air Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreezerBurnt Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 "Rumour has it only 80% of people are going to repurchase ........" Who in their right mind can make this statement as being anything close to being factual? EXACTLY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 "Rumour has it only 80% of people are going to repurchase ........" Who in their right mind can make this statement as being anything close to being factual? Ding!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! home run Mr Baker ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 As I read them, the figures from the OFSC reconciliation show D5 sales as 9192, not 25000. AHHHHHHHHHHH the truth has spoken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02Sled Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 I think the two year permit is a waste of time and resources. How many people buy the two year Val tags. Very few, since not many want to pay that far ahead. I think it would be more hassle then what it is worth, for the amount of two year permits that would be sold. I buy for two years and know others that do as well. It's a nuisance to have to go get new tags each year. They are refundable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panther340 Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Well Skidooboy....its easy for someone form Michigan to tell thousands and thousands of Northern Ontario ATV and SnowMachine owners that never use the groomed trails that they should start paying for val tags , when it won't effect your yearly budget , but will improve your trail experience ...............but for the many Northern Ontario crown land riders, ice fishermen, cottage owners................you would be transfering some of your sport expenses on to their budget. Not exactly fair. ....just my two cents Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viperules700 Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 I buy for two years and know others that do as well. It's a nuisance to have to go get new tags each year. They are refundable. Only on Vechiles they are refunable. Sleds if you switch they make you pay the full amount again. I learned the hardway. I only buy one year at a time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Quimby Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 "Rumour has it only 80% of people are going to repurchase ........" Who in their right mind can make this statement as being anything close to being factual? Just "RUMOR".. there is no survey or anything to back this up. I know the OFSC predicts a ten percent drop in sales overall. However, with some early snow that sticks around, I bet that helps the sales a lot. I believe the ten % drop in sales was based on the fact that we have had two back to back poor Winters, and historically speaking the trend has been lower sales in the third year following. I guess in reality time will tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viperules700 Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Next time I need stats, I will ask sled junk. I have no idea why they would tell me district 5 sold 25000 permits. Oh well, hopefully we get a good season this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbakernbay Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 That's okay, I'm just hoping this prediction doesn't actually happen. I see in the OFSC's Go Snowmobiling Magazine that I received today that the actual cost of maintaining the trails last season was approximately $5,000,000 more than was taken in from Trail Permit revenues. Much of the difference is made up from Provincial Government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreezerBurnt Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Early cold for a couple weeks and then gradual snow and people will all be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classic Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 That's okay, I'm just hoping this prediction doesn't actually happen. I see in the OFSC's Go Snowmobiling Magazine that I received today that the actual cost of maintaining the trails last season was approximately $5,000,000 more than was taken in from Trail Permit revenues. Much of the difference is made up from Provincial Government. The provincial Gov pays nothing to maintain trails. Only infrastruture. That 5 mil shortage has been that way every year for as long as I can remember. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doo'n it Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 That's okay, I'm just hoping this prediction doesn't actually happen. I see in the OFSC's Go Snowmobiling Magazine that I received today that the actual cost of maintaining the trails last season was approximately $5,000,000 more than was taken in from Trail Permit revenues. Much of the difference is made up from Provincial Government. If they were short 5 million last year how much are they short when SW On trail actually open and need grooming?I would think with the lack of snow and no grooming in huge portions of the province there would be a surplus.We're in trouble if this keeps up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skidooboy Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Well Skidooboy....its easy for someone form Michigan to tell thousands and thousands of Northern Ontario ATV and SnowMachine owners that never use the groomed trails that they should start paying for val tags , when it won't effect your yearly budget , but will improve your trail experience ...............but for the many Northern Ontario crown land riders, ice fishermen, cottage owners................you would be transfering some of your sport expenses on to their budget. Not exactly fair. ....just my two cents easy for you to armchair quarterback me. i guess you think i am just another american wanting to rape and take EVERYTHING northern ontatrio has for myself, without giving back. personally i dont tour, or trail ride anymore, havent for years. i still buy at least 2 permits even though i ride little or no trails. i have worked for several of the clubs volunteering time at snow shows selling permits, sold permits from my house, brought hundreds of new people up on my own. tried to be the "ambassador of the northern ontario trails" online and in person, trying to get anyone and everyone who would listen, to come up to northern ontario. i've spent time brushing, signing, breaking trail, search and resue when asked, played "tour guide" for residents and non residents. but, i am the big bad american who only brought up the question, is it fair for those in the north not to pay for val tags? this is where i get burned out like my brother Luc in dubreuilville and say... screw it, I'm Done. i'll not buy another permit, i'll fish, ride crown land, and hydro right of ways. and wish you all the best of luck. this really got under my skin, singling me out. i am one of the biggest supporters, even though i am from the states. i probably have done more support and advertizing for the regional businesses, and ofsc clubs in district 13,14,15 and the now defunct 16 than most residents of the same area. i wish you good day SIR! Ski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToSlow Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 the post count shows you have been around for awhile, and i for one want to thank you for all you have done and will do in the future i hope for our sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Quimby Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Skidooboy...don't pack it in. I too was recently chastised on this forum by one or two of my own home club volunteers! Because I have an opinion that differs from theirs? A volunteer is a volunteer ( I believe Yukon ) said that and it is true. Club President, or new guy hauling a chainsaw..they are all valuable and deserve to be treated as such. A volunteer in any capacity these days is something to be valued and treasured. So thank you and please don't stop. I have met club volunteers that have been around for forty years and will share with you great stories, and interesting information . Then...I have met those that feel they are gods gift to sledding and are king or queen of the trails. Nobody is better than the next volunteer in line. We're all in the same business. Far north, near north or south or central Ontario....same problems same issues...different players. We're here to deliver trails and have some fun along the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
couchrocket500 Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Don't sweat it over one guy's comment Skidooboy, I've always enjoyed reading your posts... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Your input is appreciated, Ski. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dweese Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Only on Vechiles they are refunable. Sleds if you switch they make you pay the full amount again. I learned the hardway. I only buy one year at a time. Transferable only, not refundable anymore on vechicals. One of the guys at work just switched from a truck to an SUV, had to buy new ones and no refund on the old ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 In both of ourgreat countries we have freedom of speech. With this comes the need to tolerate and understand other opinions. At some point on forums someone will dissagree with you. Such is life . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panther340 Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Wow Skidooboy ........your are taking me completely out of context, I was not at all challenging you on your passion or volunteerism for the sport, I have been on this site long enough to see how you ask to help groom and trail work etc numerous times. My only concern was that as American Tourist you do not neccessarily understand the impact your cost sharing of val tags would have on the tax payers of Ontario that just want to go ice fishing or use the many snow covered rural roads that bylaws for many communities allow. Heck on the Northshore of Huron here the OFSC trails have not been open more than a few weeks the past few years due to lack of snow . My only challenge was about suggesting "governance of the tags" be spread across all sled or ATV owners, because in essence that will not impact American riders who do their own sled or ATV governance of tags in their state. Just like you would not want me to tell you how your state should handle gun registry. I am not slagging your passion on volunteereism and tourists dollars spent in Canada............thank you for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skidooboy Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 point taken panther. now i am going to ask you... what is your idea to help fix this failing system? how do you think that it is fair for those in the south to pay for val tags, and those in the north do not, yet reap the benefit's of the same trail system to get to camps and lakes? last i checked most (not all) people leave from home, town, and have to be on the "trail" at some point to get from one to the other. like i said, i dont think they should have to buy the trail permit to trap or fish, as long as they arent abusing the system for instance say... someone living in the soo, saying they are going fishing at wawa lake, and ride the ofsc trails all the way there and back. all i am saying is... i beleive to be fair, the val tags should be done equally for ALL SLEDDERS, NO MATTER WHERE THEY LIVE IN ONTARIO. those added monies would benefit the camp goer's and fisherman in the north and south, by providing better accesses to public, and private lands. the val tags like our registrations in michigan are really small fees that wont upset most household budgets. what i think you are also confusing is... i still have to register my sleds in michigan to ride in ontario. if i dont, the stop and opp officers will see to it that i am fined, or impounded. so in essance, it does effect me. i pay my val tags for here, without them, i cant ride there. yet my permit price is higher because the ofsc, mto, and mnr cant control costs, and come up with better solutions to raise needed funds. one easy way to do this would be to make ALL residents buy val tags. again, this money helps EVERYONE, not just touring sledders. and by doing that it still effects me because, the permit costs will still not go down because, the few sleds left with unpaid val tags are not enough to "right the ship". it will help but, there will still be more needed. i take this seriously because, if I dont.... it wont be there for my kid and grandkids. i dont consider myself a "tourist". we are up there more than anywhere, fishing, riding sleds, riding bikes, visiting friends ect.... i've tried several times to buy property, we would love to retire up there. it just sets me off when someone says, i dont understand the plight up there. beleive me, enough of my closest and dearest friends live or lived and moved south from the nothern ontario region. i know it is hard to live up there. i want to protect that, and help come up with ideas to save, and rebuild the systems. if we dont, there might be alot more club closures, and "ghost towns" up there. then there wont be ANYONE riding up there to fish, hunt, trap, or to tour. no people, no tourists from the region, the states or other provinces, no more revenue. all these things will and are killing the far north, and that in itself saddens me. Ski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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