Wildbill Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 34 minutes ago, bbakernbay said: Are other user groups contributing to the costs or just OFSC Trail Permit revenue combined with Provincial $$? 34 minutes ago, bbakernbay said: Are other user groups contributing to the costs or just OFSC Trail Permit revenue combined with Provincial $$? Money is coming from some ATV groups too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperG Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 Yes I totally agree, thank the Weeks for the time they gave us for the use of their property and I understand their frustrations with the government, I think we ALL can say that. On the other note though, most of the family are sledders too and SHOULD realise the significant impact on the local economy this will cause, because of their stubbornness to come to any common sense on what they are doing. They have been told SEVERAL times that bill 100 will not affect them or their property and being upset with the government, this is NOT going to change the governments way of doing business by keeping the trails closed on their property. Furthermore, The next lowest tender was from a man you helped form the foundation and VOLUNTEERED his time and sometimes machinery to PARK TO PARK! As well yes he may be about $9000 more BUT was also going to do a bit more trail work on the trail THAN the Weeks! For a man who does support the sports, area and VOLUNTEERED his time to PARK TO PARK as well as the snowmobile clubs. I think it WOULD be wise to give him the tender and would be justified in getting the tender. I also would believe A LOT of people would gladly put some more money into the go fundme project just to make sure that said lowest bidder not get it and someone who supports the sports and was going to do a bit more trail work get the tender instead. Again all comments are of my own opinions and NOT that of the clubs or any organisations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 26 minutes ago, SuperG said: Yes I totally agree, thank the Weeks for the time they gave us for the use of their property and I understand their frustrations with the government, I think we ALL can say that. On the other note though, most of the family are sledders too and SHOULD realise the significant impact on the local economy this will cause, because of their stubbornness to come to any common sense on what they are doing. They have been told SEVERAL times that bill 100 will not affect them or their property and being upset with the government, this is NOT going to change the governments way of doing business by keeping the trails closed on their property. Furthermore, The next lowest tender was from a man you helped form the foundation and VOLUNTEERED his time and sometimes machinery to PARK TO PARK! As well yes he may be about $9000 more BUT was also going to do a bit more trail work on the trail THAN the Weeks! For a man who does support the sports, area and VOLUNTEERED his time to PARK TO PARK as well as the snowmobile clubs. I think it WOULD be wise to give him the tender and would be justified in getting the tender. I also would believe A LOT of people would gladly put some more money into the go fundme project just to make sure that said lowest bidder not get it and someone who supports the sports and was going to do a bit more trail work get the tender instead. Again all comments are of my own opinions and NOT that of the clubs or any organisations. It is outside of the tender process and we do not have 9 grand . It is unfortunate but it is reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soupkids Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 11 hours ago, Wildbill said: It is outside of the tender process and we do not have 9 grand . It is unfortunate but it is reality. Oh come on bill, it would be just a small donation from your business to the club. In getting back to the point here I'm sure the tender process was started before they pulled the permission( I am well aware of how this process works). It just feels really bad to give $$ to a company that has pulled permission. Has the club gone to the district to see if there is $$ available. I know in D12 there is an emergency trail fund set up for situations where a club cannot fund a project that is discovered or over and above budgeted work. I know with MOTS the waters are a little muddy but it might be worth a try Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticCrusher Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 Did the government have any consultation with land owners prior to this bill being drafted? It's sad to see these trails close as they were quite nice. It sounds like they and others are listening to poor legal advice regarding granted permission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 3 hours ago, soupkids said: Oh come on bill, it would be just a small donation from your business to the club. In getting back to the point here I'm sure the tender process was started before they pulled the permission( I am well aware of how this process works). It just feels really bad to give $$ to a company that has pulled permission. Has the club gone to the district to see if there is $$ available. I know in D12 there is an emergency trail fund set up for situations where a club cannot fund a project that is discovered or over and above budgeted work. I know with MOTS the waters are a little muddy but it might be worth a try yes and the district an p2p are also part of the funding . For the record talks are always ongoing with the landowner the door is open a little bit we would be best not to nail the door shut this conversation may not be helping this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02Sled Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 23 minutes ago, Wildbill said: yes and the district an p2p are also part of the funding . For the record talks are always ongoing with the landowner the door is open a little bit we would be best not to nail the door shut this conversation may not be helping this. That is why I always maintain that while disappointed at the loss of a trail, always respect their decision as the landowner and kindly say thank you for the use of your land these many years past. We truly appreciate it. Why would you want to alienate people and burn bridges. Other land owners look and say this is the thanks we get for the use of our land if circumstances change. Heck with it... get off now. Having a good relationship with land owners regardless whether we have a trail on their property or not speaks to our reputation as an organization. Even those that don't have a trail on their property are part of the community we rely on at large. We also want the support of the community for our sport. A community turns against you... you are cooked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticCrusher Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 1 hour ago, Wildbill said: yes and the district an p2p are also part of the funding . For the record talks are always ongoing with the landowner the door is open a little bit we would be best not to nail the door shut this conversation may not be helping this. It's their land and they are big into sledding, hopefully there can be some positive outcome. Always have to keep the door open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbakernbay Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 Good luck on both the project and any possible landowner negotiations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 1 hour ago, ArcticCrusher said: It's their land and they are big into sledding, hopefully there can be some positive outcome. Always have to keep the door open. exactly and as this thread carries on loose lips sink ships . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yukon Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 There are certain things that should be kept close to the heart and things that require flying under the radar. A thread like this can be very detrimental to any positive club stewardship. Somethings arent meant for the general public or forums. If you want transparency join a club.... It's that simple. I personally hope Lemons will turn to Lemonade and that, the club, District and Landowner can and will work something out through ongoing efforts and good comunication. This is all I will say in this topic.. Flame on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soupkids Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 Just don't award the reroute of the trails around them to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamGamble Posted November 15, 2016 Share Posted November 15, 2016 This is a very sobering read Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlowTouringGuy Posted November 15, 2016 Share Posted November 15, 2016 On 2016-11-12 at 6:59 PM, Yukon Cornelious said: If you want transparency join a club.... It's that simple. Hey Yukon.....how's by you ? I'm sorry to say (and you probably know it) that your statement is too general to be the solution. There are (unfortunately) still clubs which are less than transparent. Some translucent, and some (even) opaque. Greater transparency at the club level (in general) has been happening and we all hope it will continue to improve. It sounds like your club is supportive of open communication and is a model for many others. Congrats ! Let's hope that some day all clubs will operate similarly ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake G Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 The Weeks family provided a lengthy rationale for their decision, in a December 15, 2016 Letter to the Editor: http://www.parrysound.com/opinion-story/7022382-easements-for-snowmobile-trails-prompts-closure-of-some-parry-sound-routes/#.WFlzjGbrzJA.facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blown corner Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 Kinda makes sense and gives a better understanding of how landowners are feeling from their side. These people unless tooting their own horn sound like community involved people that don't want the cons of government pulling another fast one. It's hard to take but I can understand their position. The gov probably wants to gain all access to private owned sections of trail then sell it off to a foreign country to run it with tolls on top of our passes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowchopper Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 Sad how Bill 100 is hurting our sport. The Government if they were thinking correctly should be enhancing it. Sledders spend lots of money in alot of communities .Bill 100 needs to go away with Wynne also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZR SLEDHEAD Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 Everything the Ontario Liberals touch turns into a nightmare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperG Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 Yes definitely see their point and don't blame them one bit. But Bill 100 has been amended a bit and all of our LUP's have that new paragraph in it stating that we will NOT impose any easements on their property and if the government does then we would basically pull the trails ourselves. All available info has been passed onto them but we have to respect their land and decision. Yes some part of bill 100 is hurting the sport but they did put some more good into it such as uping the trespass fine from $1000 to $10,000 etc. It's here and not going away anytime soon so we must make the best of it and deal with it the best we know how. On the bright side of things, the Carling trailblazers have done an excellent job and worked hard to make a usable trail to keep a trail into parry sound and have kept a connection to C trail north so that won't be affected. Good job to all involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slomo Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 10 hours ago, Blake G said: The Weeks family provided a lengthy rationale for their decision, in a December 15, 2016 Letter to the Editor: http://www.parrysound.com/opinion-story/7022382-easements-for-snowmobile-trails-prompts-closure-of-some-parry-sound-routes/#.WFlzjGbrzJA.facebook Some observations: -The Weeks might want to remember and acknowledge from whom they have the privilege of mining gravel and aggregates which is core to their business - the Crown and taxpaying citizens who own the land. -Comparing their perceived point of view to that of the natives blocking the 4 lane highway is ridiculous - different land ownership structure for one thing - indeed suggesting that this strategy is a good thing economically. -Painfully obvious that the OFSC has dropped the ball here as noted in other posts on this topic - things not likely to change with the 8 year extension to the old regime in terms of marketing the sport - already seen how the motorheads have caused trails to be closed by land owners who have had enough. -Save some money folks - you're going to need it for travelling if you want to snowmobile in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PISTON LAKE CRUISER Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 1 hour ago, slomo said: Some observations: -The Weeks might want to remember and acknowledge from whom they have the privilege of mining gravel and aggregates which is core to their business - the Crown and taxpaying citizens who own the land. -Comparing their perceived point of view to that of the natives blocking the 4 lane highway is ridiculous - different land ownership structure for one thing - indeed suggesting that this strategy is a good thing economically. -Painfully obvious that the OFSC has dropped the ball here as noted in other posts on this topic - things not likely to change with the 8 year extension to the old regime in terms of marketing the sport - already seen how the motorheads have caused trails to be closed by land owners who have had enough. -Save some money folks - you're going to need it for travelling if you want to snowmobile in the future. If the Weeks family are mining gravel they own the land they are mining or are paying for that privilege either in the form of a lease or per tonne to the land owner. Either way, they don't owe taxpaying citizens diddly squat IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blown corner Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 SuperG, those 400 series around Nobel aren't available then? just the C north got re routed to go north? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadoo Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 5 hours ago, PISTON LAKE CRUISER said: If the Weeks family are mining gravel they own the land they are mining or are paying for that privilege either in the form of a lease or per tonne to the land owner. Either way, they don't owe taxpaying citizens diddly squat IMHO. What do snowmobilers who no longer have trails due to their personal beef with the government owe them? Pretty damn arrogant of them to write that. Don't use me as a pawn and ask for my support. The clubs and ofsc need to step the f up though, Massive ball drop for sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blown corner Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 Ya Canadoo yer right, feeling like a pawn on this one. And also right about the ofsc. Clubs probably gave their all to try and save the trail. Ofsc is the problem in dealing with the government or lack there of to straighten this crap out. I support the land owners but I wont trust the government either in this case. Its a mess only going to worse times like slomo says. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PISTON LAKE CRUISER Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 7 hours ago, Canadoo said: What do snowmobilers who no longer have trails due to their personal beef with the government owe them? Pretty damn arrogant of them to write that. Don't use me as a pawn and ask for my support. The clubs and ofsc need to step the f up though, Massive ball drop for sure Personally I think that snowmobilers owe the Weeks family a vote of thanks for allowing them to use property in their (Weeks) control to put snowmobile trails on what it appears to an outsider to be a number of years. Quite frankly in my humble opinion, we should be glad we haven't lost more land use agreements at this point. The real cause of all this BS is the Wynne government who started the ball rolling by creating Bill 100 in the same fashion that she seems to do everything, Half Assed! So if you want to blame someone maybe you should start with her and the people who voted for the witch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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