OFSC AGM 2010 Who's Going from OC

[The Groomer Guy]

OFSC AGM is September 16th Anyone from Here going this year, We should Plan to Hangout.

[Yukon]

Lots of us online guys are going to be there , I'll be easy to find with Yukon stuck to my head .

Otherwise just listen for yodeling and you will find us !

[Wildbill]

I am going because Nutter is buying booze

[SlowTouringGuy]

Don't forget to Vote Snowcrest Riders the Club of the Year !!!!

[LuvMyViper]

Hey Luc.. Where is the AGM?? I am in Toronto on Sept 15th and Sept 16th for the Roger Waters - The Wall Live.......

[SlowTouringGuy]

Hey Luc.. Where is the AGM?? I am in Toronto on Sept 15th and Sept 16th for the Roger Waters - The Wall Live.......

One would think that the OFSC would want to make that information easy to find. Go to OFSC.ON.CA and surf for 20 or 30 minutes and see if you can find the answer.

Now, I will admit that that "The Indomitable" tells me I have no "looking skills" but............ you go ahead and try to find the answer on that website.

[Nutter]

Hey Luc.. Where is the AGM?? I am in Toronto on Sept 15th and Sept 16th for the Roger Waters - The Wall Live.......

One would think that the OFSC would want to make that information easy to find. Go to OFSC.ON.CA and surf for 20 or 30 minutes and see if you can find the answer.

Now, I will admit that that "The Indomitable" tells me I have no "looking skills" but............ you go ahead and try to find the answer on that website.

Go into the club house section of the OFSC site then resources, and you'll see AGM info. No need to put it in the public section of the website it's not a public event. Every club knows where it's being held a year in advance, and receives an AGM registration package.

[Nutter]

I am going because Nutter is buying booze

I'm good for a round, but I hear Chalet Yukon is going to be the place to be

Hey Luc.. Where is the AGM?? I am in Toronto on Sept 15th and Sept 16th for the Roger Waters - The Wall Live.......

This year it's Blue Mountain Collingwood Rick

[SlowTouringGuy]

Hey Luc.. Where is the AGM?? I am in Toronto on Sept 15th and Sept 16th for the Roger Waters - The Wall Live.......

One would think that the OFSC would want to make that information easy to find. Go to OFSC.ON.CA and surf for 20 or 30 minutes and see if you can find the answer.

Now, I will admit that that "The Indomitable" tells me I have no "looking skills" but............ you go ahead and try to find the answer on that website.

Go into the club house section of the OFSC site then resources, and you'll see AGM info. No need to put it in the public website section of the website it's not a public event. Every club knows where it's being held a year in advance, and receives an AGM registration package.

I know that's where it is for those that log on. But.......

I disagree about what is and isnt' a 'public event'. The regular everyday permit purchasing club member may want to know where the AGM is being held. Why is it a secret?

[SlowTouringGuy]

Hey Luc.. Where is the AGM?? I am in Toronto on Sept 15th and Sept 16th for the Roger Waters - The Wall Live.......

One would think that the OFSC would want to make that information easy to find. Go to OFSC.ON.CA and surf for 20 or 30 minutes and see if you can find the answer.

Now, I will admit that that "The Indomitable" tells me I have no "looking skills" but............ you go ahead and try to find the answer on that website.

Go into the club house section of the OFSC site then resources, and you'll see AGM info. No need to put it in the public website section of the website it's not a public event. Every club knows where it's being held a year in advance, and receives an AGM registration package.

I know that's where it is for those that log on. But.......

I disagree about what is and isnt' a 'public event'. The regular everyday permit purchasing club member may want to know where the AGM is being held. Why is it a secret?

Oh, and, BTW, don't forget to vote the Snowcrest Riders the Club of the Year !!!!

[skidooer]

Now, I will admit that that "The Indomitable" tells me I have no "looking skills" but............ you go ahead and try to find the answer on that website.

This mysterious page talks about Gravenhurst. Even if that is not true, it is still funny what will appear in a simple Google search. Apparently the OFSC is working on an iPhone app also.

[Nutter]

Hey Luc.. Where is the AGM?? I am in Toronto on Sept 15th and Sept 16th for the Roger Waters - The Wall Live.......

One would think that the OFSC would want to make that information easy to find. Go to OFSC.ON.CA and surf for 20 or 30 minutes and see if you can find the answer.

Now, I will admit that that "The Indomitable" tells me I have no "looking skills" but............ you go ahead and try to find the answer on that website.

Go into the club house section of the OFSC site then resources, and you'll see AGM info. No need to put it in the public website section of the website it's not a public event. Every club knows where it's being held a year in advance, and receives an AGM registration package.

I know that's where it is for those that log on. But.......

I disagree about what is and isnt' a 'public event'. The regular everyday permit purchasing club member may want to know where the AGM is being held. Why is it a secret?

Why should it be a public event, were trying to get a years worth of business done, not shake hands and kiss babys and listen to frivolous complaints from the ill informed ? Each club recieves a registration package and votes on who ther deligates and attendies are, for those who have a vested interest and are interested in attending they will know the what where when and why through their local club almost a year in advance. If a local clubs exec's are not sharing that info with their membership it's time for a change in that clubs exec.

[SlowTouringGuy]

Why should it be a public event, were trying to get a years worth of business done, not shake hands and kiss babys and listen to frivolous complaints from the ill informed ? Each club recieves a registration package and votes on who ther deligates and attendies are, for those who have a vested interest and are interested in attending they will know the what where when and why through their local club almost a year in advance. If a local clubs exec's are not sharing that info with their membership it's time for a change in that clubs exec.

As you have so often said it is an organization built by and for volunteers. It behooves an organization such as that to encourage as much participation as possible in as many ways as possible. For its own health and growth it should not make it difficult in any way whatsoever to engage. Either through meetings, club functions, Provincial functions or the good ole InterWeb. Don't invite the general public to vote but encourage them to attend. Let them see how they can participate and get involved.

Transparency is healthy.

[UsedtoSkidoo]

Why should it be a public event, were trying to get a years worth of business done, not shake hands and kiss babys and listen to frivolous complaints from the ill informed ?

Nutter, did you just say this? and you go off every time we call it an Old Boys Club...........

Frig man.

[Nutter]

Why should it be a public event, were trying to get a years worth of business done, not shake hands and kiss babys and listen to frivolous complaints from the ill informed ? Each club recieves a registration package and votes on who ther deligates and attendies are, for those who have a vested interest and are interested in attending they will know the what where when and why through their local club almost a year in advance. If a local clubs exec's are not sharing that info with their membership it's time for a change in that clubs exec.

As you have so often said it is an organization built by and for volunteers. It behooves an organization such as that to encourage as much participation as possible in as many ways as possible. For its own health and growth it should not make it difficult in any way whatsoever to engage. Either through meetings, club functions, Provincial functions or the good ole InterWeb. Don't invite the general public to vote but encourage them to attend. Let them see how they can participate and get involved.

Transparency is healthy.

Sounds great in theory but crap has to get done at AGM weekend, it's already quite the feat when you consider close to if not more then 1000 attend each year, anymore then that we'd have to find another venue to fit everyone, and it'd still be mayhem on the floor come business day and in the seminars and workshops. 100% transparency is there at all times for those who want it, they just have to go through their local club to get the info, there's no need to publish things publicly in any private organization.

[Nutter]

Why should it be a public event, were trying to get a years worth of business done, not shake hands and kiss babys and listen to frivolous complaints from the ill informed ?

Nutter, did you just say this? and you go off every time we call it an Old Boys Club...........

Frig man.

???

There's a big differnce to being an "old boys club" at the club level and not accepting new volunteers to having a public AGM. See above post.

Further more the only timne I go off when someone mentions "old boys club", is when they complain and don't do anything about it. In that case how can you avoid the happening of an "old boys club" when no one else wants to step up and take over ? I see it all the time with our club and within our district, one phone call or e-mail for trail work, we make sure to give dates and mention they are published on our website weekly, and even return calls again a few days before .... and they don't show and call us an "old boys club", which you know our club is certainly not.

[SlowTouringGuy]

Why should it be a public event, were trying to get a years worth of business done, not shake hands and kiss babys and listen to frivolous complaints from the ill informed ? Each club recieves a registration package and votes on who ther deligates and attendies are, for those who have a vested interest and are interested in attending they will know the what where when and why through their local club almost a year in advance. If a local clubs exec's are not sharing that info with their membership it's time for a change in that clubs exec.

As you have so often said it is an organization built by and for volunteers. It behooves an organization such as that to encourage as much participation as possible in as many ways as possible. For its own health and growth it should not make it difficult in any way whatsoever to engage. Either through meetings, club functions, Provincial functions or the good ole InterWeb. Don't invite the general public to vote but encourage them to attend. Let them see how they can participate and get involved.

Transparency is healthy.

Sounds great in theory but crap has to get done at AGM weekend, it's already quite the feat when you consider close to if not more then 1000 attend each year, anymore then that we'd have to find another venue to fit everyone, and it'd still be mayhem on the floor come business day and in the seminars and workshops. 100% transparency is there at all times for those who want it, they just have to go through their local club to get the info, there's no need to publish things publicly in any private organization.

It's not just great in theory it is also great in practice. The OFSC as a provincial entity would benefit by being more accessible to all club members. The more open it is the more engaged people become; more openess attracts more people; more people makes a stronger organization. It addresses volunteer burn-out and counters the charges of being an old boy's club. The OFSC has been on a campaign to attract more people to the sport - why would they hinder that initiative by being less than accomodating?

[sledjunk]

Why should it be a public event, were trying to get a years worth of business done, not shake hands and kiss babys and listen to frivolous complaints from the ill informed ? Each club recieves a registration package and votes on who ther deligates and attendies are, for those who have a vested interest and are interested in attending they will know the what where when and why through their local club almost a year in advance.  If a local clubs exec's are not sharing that info with their membership it's time for a change in that clubs exec.

As you have so often said it is an organization built by and for volunteers. It behooves an organization such as that to encourage as much participation as possible in as many ways as possible. For its own health and growth it should not make it difficult in any way whatsoever to engage. Either through meetings, club functions, Provincial functions or the good ole InterWeb. Don't invite the general public to vote but encourage them to attend. Let them see how they can participate and get involved.

Transparency is healthy.

Sounds great in theory but crap has to get done at AGM weekend, it's already quite the feat when you consider close to if not more then 1000 attend each year, anymore then that we'd have to find another venue to fit everyone, and it'd still be mayhem on the floor come business day and in the seminars and workshops. 100% transparency is there at all times for those who want it, they just have to go through their local club to get the info, there's no need to publish things publicly in any private organization.

It's not just great in theory it is also great in practice. The OFSC as a provincial entity would benefit by being more accessible to all club members. The more open it is the more engaged people become; more openess attracts more people; more people makes a stronger organization. It addresses volunteer burn-out and counters the charges of being an old boy's club. The OFSC has been on a campaign to attract more people to the sport - why would they hinder that initiative by being less than accomodating?

And I suspect that opening it up would not be an issue with the venue  because there would likely only be a handful of extra people that show up.  However, the APPEARANCE of openness and inclusion would be a HUGE plus.

Just my 2¢

[Nutter]

Like I said guys, you already have close to or over 1000 under one roof trying to get business for the year done, voting on by-law and policy changes and budget ..ect and taking in seminars and workshops. With anymore where and how would you ever get anything done over the course of 2 days, and at what cost ? I'll add to that, that no one is ever refused entry to AGM, if they wish to go all they have to get a registration form from their local club and their in (they may also be voted by their club membership top the clubs voting delegate), if they don't know there's an annual OFSC AGM and when and where it is, then it would be a given they have not even gone to a club meeting and it would be a gross waste of money along with their and everyone else's time for them to be there.

[UsedtoSkidoo]

[skidooer]

the ill informed

I tried to become informed but my username and password did not work.

Further more the only timne I go off when someone mentions "old boys club", is when they complain and don't do anything about it.

But how? Every time I see someone, myself included, trying to do something about it, their ideas are quickly shot down in peer review. I will admit that my ideas are probably terrible and deserve to be shot down, but without guidance from a more experienced member my ideas are unlikely to improve. To be fair, I did have one kind individual offer to help move an idea forward, but unfortunately I did not hear back from him. I suspect my idea failed within his peer group.

With experience, it is easy to forget where you started. Believe it or not, regular every day people struggle to use a computer mouse, yet I am sure everyone here feels like it is a natural device to use. I am sure that you, Nutter, with your experience and expertise can whip out perfect proposals with your eyes closed and your hands tied behind your back, but the rest of us are not that lucky.

I have a challenge for you, Nutter, should you choose to accept it (and please do not feel obligated, I know you are a busy man). The next time someone submits their proposal for peer review, instead of shooting down the idea, work with that individual to turn the idea into something that will pass the scrutiny of peers and have a chance of succeeding at a higher level. Please open the editing process to the public as much as possible so that others can learn from your process.

And I suspect that opening it up would not be an issue with the venue  because there would likely only be a handful of extra people that show up.  However, the APPEARANCE of openness and inclusion would be a HUGE plus.

Exactly what I was thinking. If you cannot get people out to meetings in their home club, what makes anyone think that anyone is going to travel half way across the province to go to the AGM? It isn't going to happen.

To be fair, granting the ability for one to look up the definition of "old boys club" requires a proposal to be presented in front of the club, and approval at the AGM.

[Nutter]

But how? Every time I see someone, myself included, trying to do something about it, their ideas are quickly shot down in peer review. I will admit that my ideas are probably terrible and deserve to be shot down, but without guidance from a more experienced member my ideas are unlikely to improve. To be fair, I did have one kind individual offer to help move an idea forward, but unfortunately I did not hear back from him. I suspect my idea failed within his peer group.

With experience, it is easy to forget where you started. Believe it or not, regular every day people struggle to use a computer mouse, yet I am sure everyone here feels like it is a natural device to use. I am sure that you, Nutter, with your experience and expertise can whip out perfect proposals with your eyes closed and your hands tied behind your back, but the rest of us are not that lucky.

I have a challenge for you, Nutter, should you choose to accept it (and please do not feel obligated, I know you are a busy man). The next time someone submits their proposal for peer review, instead of shooting down the idea, work with that individual to turn the idea into something that will pass the scrutiny of peers and have a chance of succeeding at a higher level. Please open the editing process to the public as much as possible so that others can learn from your process.

Sorry you don't like my methods of critique Dooer, but I'm a straight shooter, I don't beat around the bush with my opinions and I don't waste other peoples time or money as well as my own. The problem with opening more up to the public on a provincial level rather then the local level it is now, is manpower and budget to service the inquiries. I know the amount of time I and my club mates put into educating and fielding questions on a local and regional level, I shutter to think of what the cost in manpower and money would be to do it at a central provincial level. Communication as it stands right now starts at the top of the chain where it is most effective, with the clubs who are the OFSC and have final say in everything, then if need be it goes down to the district and lastly it goes to the province to be provincially voted on if warranted. But the beauty as said is all is 100% transparent. If someone wants to see it, all they have to do is ask a local club, district or association, or pick up a copy of Main Trail from their local club or subscribe to the OFSC Newsletter on the home page of the OFSC website. Many say they want more information and to be more involved, but not many are willing to even ask for it other then a blog of complaint on a website.

[UsedtoSkidoo]

But how? Every time I see someone, myself included, trying to do something about it, their ideas are quickly shot down in peer review. I will admit that my ideas are probably terrible and deserve to be shot down, but without guidance from a more experienced member my ideas are unlikely to improve. To be fair, I did have one kind individual offer to help move an idea forward, but unfortunately I did not hear back from him. I suspect my idea failed within his peer group.

With experience, it is easy to forget where you started. Believe it or not, regular every day people struggle to use a computer mouse, yet I am sure everyone here feels like it is a natural device to use. I am sure that you, Nutter, with your experience and expertise can whip out perfect proposals with your eyes closed and your hands tied behind your back, but the rest of us are not that lucky.

I have a challenge for you, Nutter, should you choose to accept it (and please do not feel obligated, I know you are a busy man). The next time someone submits their proposal for peer review, instead of shooting down the idea, work with that individual to turn the idea into something that will pass the scrutiny of peers and have a chance of succeeding at a higher level. Please open the editing process to the public as much as possible so that others can learn from your process.

Sorry you don't like my methods of critique Dooer, but I'm a straight shooter, I don't beat around the bush with my opinions and I don't waste other peoples time or money as well as my own. The problem with opening more up to the public on a provincial level rather then the local level it is now, is manpower and budget to service the inquiries. I know the amount of time I and my club mates put into educating and fielding questions on a local and regional level, I shutter to think of what the cost in manpower and money would be to do it at a central provincial level. Communication as it stands right now starts at the top of the chain where it is most effective, with the clubs who are the OFSC and have final say in everything, then if need be it goes down to the district and lastly it goes to the province to be provincially voted on if warranted. But the beauty as said is all is 100% transparent. If someone wants to see it, all they have to do is ask a local club, district or association, or pick up a copy of Main Trail from their local club or subscribe to the OFSC Newsletter on the home page of the OFSC website. Many say they want more information and to be more involved, but not many are willing to even ask for it other then a blog of complaint on a website.

I understand you point about logistics and time constraints. However, that isnt for you or the OFSC to decide. Fortunately, the minute I buy a current trail permit I am able to go to a meeting of any type that the OFSC holds without it being voted upon. As an Association anyone who is a "member" is allowed to go whether or not they are "ill informed or have a frivolous complaint."

Its not for you or anyone else to decide who is ill informed or frivolous. That being said no one is going to go anyway!

[Nutter]

I understand you point about logistics and time constraints. However, that isnt for you or the OFSC to decide. Fortunately, the minute I buy a current trail permit I am able to go to a meeting of any type that the OFSC holds without it being voted upon. As an Association anyone who is a "member" is allowed to go whether or not they are "ill informed or have a frivolous complaint."

Its not for you or anyone else to decide who is ill informed or frivolous. That being said no one is going to go anyway!

Like I said guys, you already have close to or over 1000 under one roof trying to get business for the year done, voting on by-law and policy changes and budget ..ect and taking in seminars and workshops. With anymore where and how would you ever get anything done over the course of 2 days, and at what cost ? I'll add to that, that no one is ever refused entry to AGM, if they wish to go all they have to get a registration form from their local club and their in (they may also be voted by their club membership top the clubs voting delegate), if they don't know there's an annual OFSC AGM and when and where it is, then it would be a given they have not even gone to a club meeting and it would be a gross waste of money along with their and everyone else's time for them to be there.

[UsedtoSkidoo]

I understand you point about logistics and time constraints. However, that isnt for you or the OFSC to decide. Fortunately, the minute I buy a current trail permit I am able to go to a meeting of any type that the OFSC holds without it being voted upon. As an Association anyone who is a "member" is allowed to go whether or not they are "ill informed or have a frivolous complaint."

Its not for you or anyone else to decide who is ill informed or frivolous. That being said no one is going to go anyway!

Like I said guys, you already have close to or over 1000 under one roof trying to get business for the year done, voting on by-law and policy changes and budget ..ect and taking in seminars and workshops. With anymore where and how would you ever get anything done over the course of 2 days, and at what cost ? I'll add to that, that no one is ever refused entry to AGM, if they wish to go all they have to get a registration form from their local club and their in (they may also be voted by their club membership top the clubs voting delegate), if they don't know there's an annual OFSC AGM and when and where it is, then it would be a given they have not even gone to a club meeting and it would be a gross waste of money along with their and everyone else's time for them to be there.

I knew you wrote that. I was basically commenting on your attitude. It doesnt seem very positive although I do believe that such an open meeting would be logistically impossible.