Mossy Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 We too have crown land lup's and we have successfully prosecuted trail passes on them. Not trying to stir the pot but were they contested? Just curious because we have some no winter maintenance roads that are staked. There are a small handful of freeloaders that figure they are allowed on them. My understanding is you need a pass if the road is staked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02Sled Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 Not trying to stir the pot but were they contested? Just curious because we have some no winter maintenance roads that are staked. There are a small handful of freeloaders that figure they are allowed on them. My understanding is you need a pass if the road is staked. some of the questions that come to mind is it a private road or a municipal road do you have a LUP for it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faceman Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 No winter maintenance roads sadly are fair game for whomever in my opinion. We have the winter hunters that drive these roads as long as possible and there is nothing we can do about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02Sled Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 No winter maintenance roads sadly are fair game for whomever in my opinion. We have the winter hunters that drive these roads as long as possible and there is nothing we can do about it. Some of the roads in our area are not municipal roads. They are private roads owned and maintained by the cottage owners, often as a cottage association. They would be private property and no different from running a trail across any other private property with a LUP where access requires a TP. I can see where a municipal road would be one that would be accessable without a TP unless of course the township who own and maintain that road indicate it closed and sign a LUP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Saul Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 No winter maintenance roads sadly are fair game for whomever in my opinion. We have the winter hunters that drive these roads as long as possible and there is nothing we can do about it. We went to the twp & got lups signed so the roads are deemed trail in winter, worked for us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elliotgroomer Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 We were told at our district meeting that the province would be changing the set fines for no permits for the 2016 season to $400.00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sledjunk Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 We were told at our district meeting that the province would be changing the set fines for no permits for the 2016 season to $400.00 That would be nice! However, I am skeptical on the accuracy of that. I suspect, and I mean no disrespect, that there is a misunderstanding between the motion that was passed at AGM to ask the MTO to allow a new permit type for 'on trail' sales at $400, and actually changing the fine. I hope I am wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02Sled Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 That would be nice! However, I am skeptical on the accuracy of that. I suspect, and I mean no disrespect, that there is a misunderstanding between the motion that was passed at AGM to ask the MTO to allow a new permit type for 'on trail' sales at $400, and actually changing the fine. I hope I am wrong. I recall the motion that passed as you do sledjunk... a new permit type which would be a trailside permit at $400 be recommended to the MTO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AkronOrange Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 So how much is generated annually by fining those without a valid permit? How much does enforcement cost? Why not charge them for 2 years worth of permits at the highest rate and let them have permits for 2 years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mossy Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 We were told at our district meeting that the province would be changing the set fines for no permits for the 2016 season to $400.00 Where would the fine money go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Where would the fine money go? the province Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domino Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 The fines and enforcement are a deterrent. The fine needs to be significant enough to encourage compliance. If the fine for not having a permit was $10,000, compliance would not be an issue. The revenue for province would be $0-$10,000, cause there is always one idiot out there. I believe they try to balance out the fines to encourage people to try their luck as that is more revenue to the province. If speeding fines were too high, we wouldn't speed. Then how would they pay for their pensions? The province may likely go for the $400. If you make too high, then the enforcement officials will be hesitant to lay the charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlowTouringGuy Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 the province Who pays the expenses for enforcement? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domino Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Who pays the expenses for enforcement? If its the OPP, the province. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Who pays the expenses for enforcement? The OPP bill the local township ie Seguin is expecting a 1.8 million dollar bill next year as the province downloads the costs to clear it from their budget http://www.seguin.ca/en/township/OPP.asp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mossy Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 the province It would benefit the OFSC if the fines were shared. Just saying. The fines and enforcement are a deterrent. The fine needs to be significant enough to encourage compliance. If the fine for not having a permit was $10,000, compliance would not be an issue. The revenue for province would be $0-$10,000, cause there is always one idiot out there. I believe they try to balance out the fines to encourage people to try their luck as that is more revenue to the province. If speeding fines were too high, we wouldn't speed. Then how would they pay for their pensions? The province may likely go for the $400. If you make too high, then the enforcement officials will be hesitant to lay the charge. I completely agree! Impound their sled too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02Sled Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 It would benefit the OFSC if the fines were shared. Just saying. I completely agree! Impound their sled too! Like you said, impound the sled. Something like the game wardens have the power to do with poachers or over limit catches. and let the court decide if and when you get your property back. Impound the sled and let the court decide if and when you get it back. Odds are you won't even get to court until summer so that would end that season for sure and possibly more. Strong deterrent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue er Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Impounding really? All thats gonna do is make people run. Poaching wildlife is a completly different problem then trespassing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02Sled Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Impounding really? All thats gonna do is make people run. Poaching wildlife is a completly different problem then trespassing Get the sled impounded once and you'll never do it again.... you do realize that having too many fish or fish out of season can get your truck, boat and trailer impounded... they are indeed different but stealing from the volunteers is not something to sluff off like some do. Are you suggesting that only sledders would run if caught but people wouldn't run from the game warden perhaps on their ATV or boat for breaking the law Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mossy Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Impounding really? All thats gonna do is make people run. Poaching wildlife is a completly different problem then trespassing Absolutely! If they don't pay the fine the sled goes to auction! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue er Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Yup sleds whole lot faster than boats or atvs why invite a dangerous situation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue er Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 So is it trespassing or stealing got to be one or the other Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 its being a$$holes cause they think it is smart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue er Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 its being a$$holes cause they think it is smart No doubt bill. But can make all the rules and fines you want still need the enforcement no just a check stop on a rail trail saturday afternoon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snapper Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 If its the OPP, the province. Just wandering, who pays for enforcement on the privately owned 407 highway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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