Greggie Posted August 28, 2014 Share Posted August 28, 2014 From what I have heard there are several clubs not in good standing this moment, reason bad financial management. Most of there clubs aren't frugal spending their money. It's time for all clubs to go to the basics. Snowmobiling is a volunteer organization/clubs and we need to stop paying "volunteers". Back to the basics means stopping with expensive trail work, expensive admin cost and so on. The moto of the 2014-2015 saeson must be "Back to the basics". Thanks Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildman Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 From what I have heard there are several clubs not in good standing this moment, reason bad financial management. Most of there clubs aren't frugal spending their money. It's time for all clubs to go to the basics. Snowmobiling is a volunteer organization/clubs and we need to stop paying "volunteers". Back to the basics means stopping with expensive trail work, expensive admin cost and so on. The moto of the 2014-2015 saeson must be "Back to the basics". Thanks Greg Does your club pay groomer operators? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggie Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 Does your club pay groomer operators? I have nothing against paying groomer operators if the club can afford it. There are clubs who pay "volunteers" for putting signs up. Pay $3000 to $8000 for keeping the books. Pay volunteers $0.45 for every km with the car, snowmobile and atv. Land owners suppers for $7000. And then they are crying that they have no money? Thanks Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildman Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 I have nothing against paying groomer operators if the club can afford it. There are clubs who pay "volunteers" for putting signs up. Pay $3000 to $8000 for keeping the books. Pay volunteers $0.45 for every km with the car, snowmobile and atv. Land owners suppers for $7000. And then they are crying that they have no money? Thanks Greg that is not what I asked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sledjunk Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 I have nothing against paying groomer operators if the club can afford it. There are clubs who pay "volunteers" for putting signs up. Pay $3000 to $8000 for keeping the books. Pay volunteers $0.45 for every km with the car, snowmobile and atv. Land owners suppers for $7000. And then they are crying that they have no money? Thanks Greg I do not know where you get your information, but I suspect that it may be only half a story. Is it possible that they do not have a volunteer with the necessary skills to do the bookkeeping, and therefore 3 - 8 K is necessary to have a commercial entity do it? Paying for mileage is an out of pocket expense. You are suggesting that every volunteer should also donate their fuel? We have volunteers who put almost 4000 Km on their vehicles on club business. I would not expect anyone to have to do that out of pocket. I agree clubs have to be as frugal as possible, but unless you are part of the club and the decision making process, then this is just spreading rumours and discontent. I prefer to think that club executives are trying to do the best possible for their club and volunteers. If you have specific details of abuse, then they should be reported to the appropriate people at the OFSC, District, or Police. Other than that, you are just spouting innuendo that does no good at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
volunteer2 Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 I do not know where you get your information, but I suspect that it may be only half a story. Is it possible that they do not have a volunteer with the necessary skills to do the bookkeeping, and therefore 3 - 8 K is necessary to have a commercial entity do it? Paying for mileage is an out of pocket expense. You are suggesting that every volunteer should also donate their fuel? We have volunteers who put almost 4000 Km on their vehicles on club business. I would not expect anyone to have to do that out of pocket. I agree clubs have to be as frugal as possible, but unless you are part of the club and the decision making process, then this is just spreading rumours and discontent. I prefer to think that club executives are trying to do the best possible for their club and volunteers. If you have specific details of abuse, then they should be reported to the appropriate people at the OFSC, District, or Police. Other than that, you are just spouting innuendo that does no good at all. X2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildman Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 I do not know where you get your information, but I suspect that it may be only half a story. Is it possible that they do not have a volunteer with the necessary skills to do the bookkeeping, and therefore 3 - 8 K is necessary to have a commercial entity do it? Paying for mileage is an out of pocket expense. You are suggesting that every volunteer should also donate their fuel? We have volunteers who put almost 4000 Km on their vehicles on club business. I would not expect anyone to have to do that out of pocket. I agree clubs have to be as frugal as possible, but unless you are part of the club and the decision making process, then this is just spreading rumours and discontent. I prefer to think that club executives are trying to do the best possible for their club and volunteers. If you have specific details of abuse, then they should be reported to the appropriate people at the OFSC, District, or Police. Other than that, you are just spouting innuendo that does no good at all. the only thing my club pays any volunteer is mileage to AGM. We pay nothing for fuel for staking trail or anything else. Nothing for district meetings(fuel or mileage wise). I guess that is why the club has money. I guess we just figure it is a cost for the love of the sport, and honestly, nobody has ever asked for fuel money or mileage as long as I have been a part of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggie Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 the only thing my club pays any volunteer is mileage to AGM. We pay nothing for fuel for staking trail or anything else. Nothing for district meetings(fuel or mileage wise). I guess that is why the club has money. I guess we just figure it is a cost for the love of the sport, and honestly, nobody has ever asked for fuel money or mileage as long as I have been a part of it.We also never paid for mileage to the agm. Yes we paid our groomer operators and financial we did well last year, a profit from slmost $25,000 before amortization. Thanks Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viperules700 Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 We also never paid for mileage to the agm. Yes we paid our groomer operators and financial we did well last year, a profit from slmost $25,000 before amortization. Thanks Greg Maybe you shouldn't have done a land owner supper! Have to give something to people that donate the use of thier property! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shook Up Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 Maybe you shouldn't have done a land owner supper! Have to give something to people that donate the use of thier property! I don't think Gregs club did the landowner supper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viperules700 Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 Maybe you should have done a land owner supper! Have to give something to people that donate the use of thier property! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viperules700 Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 I don't think Gregs club did the landowner supper. It was a typo! He should have done one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white dragon Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 I do not know where you get your information, but I suspect that it may be only half a story. Is it possible that they do not have a volunteer with the necessary skills to do the bookkeeping, and therefore 3 - 8 K is necessary to have a commercial entity do it? Paying for mileage is an out of pocket expense. You are suggesting that every volunteer should also donate their fuel? We have volunteers who put almost 4000 Km on their vehicles on club business. I would not expect anyone to have to do that out of pocket. I agree clubs have to be as frugal as possible, but unless you are part of the club and the decision making process, then this is just spreading rumours and discontent. I prefer to think that club executives are trying to do the best possible for their club and volunteers. If you have specific details of abuse, then they should be reported to the appropriate people at the OFSC, District, or Police. Other than that, you are just spouting innuendo that does no good at all. x3...like greggie just cause he has dutch background but accusing other clubs without prove is wrong.i think most volunteer put out pocket & never ask for a penny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vooodooo Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 I think maybe Greggie is in a better position than many other clubs. Ours has some, not a lot of reserve money. What we don't have is people to sit on the executive, cut stake and maintain trail. I do understand there has been abuse in the past of OFSC funds, but the alternative for some of us will simply be not opening trails this year. Our payouts at a club level have been maybe one or two hundred a year for many years. No one bills for crap. I hope we can mostly agree that paying to get trails (usefull, high use trails) open is better than not opening at all. If I could wave my magic wand and create a new crop of volunteers I would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggie Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 Maybe you shouldn't have done a land owner supper! Have to give something to people that donate the use of thier property! We have never done a landowner supper. Because we can't afford it. Thanks Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggie Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 I think maybe Greggie is in a better position than many other clubs. Ours has some, not a lot of reserve money. What we don't have is people to sit on the executive, cut stake and maintain trail. I do understand there has been abuse in the past of OFSC funds, but the alternative for some of us will simply be not opening trails this year. Our payouts at a club level have been maybe one or two hundred a year for many years. No one bills for crap. I hope we can mostly agree that paying to get trails (usefull, high use trails) open is better than not opening at all. If I could wave my magic wand and create a new crop of volunteers I would. It's take years to change a club. In 2005 we didn't have any working groomer and we were $20,000 in the hole. Now we have about $25,000 reserved for a new groomer and have 4 good working groomers. Nobody was paid for gas and out of pocket expenses. Also not for agm or district meetings km's. Two year ago we sold only 450 permits, last season we sold 815 permits. In 2005 we had almost no volunteers now we are doing well. Thanks Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sledjunk Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 We do a Landowner Appreciation Dinner eery year. All of our landowners and volunteers are invited Typical cost is around $1000 but we probably wouldn't have trails if we didn't do one. Just a cost of doing business, unfortunately. We are able to keep the costs in check by holding it in one of the local community halls (Legion, etc) and use the Ladies Auxiliary to cater. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mossy Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 We do a Landowner Appreciation Dinner eery year. All of our landowners and volunteers are invited Typical cost is around $1000 but we probably wouldn't have trails if we didn't do one. Just a cost of doing business, unfortunately. We are able to keep the costs in check by holding it in one of the local community halls (Legion, etc) and use the Ladies Auxiliary to cater. Same here. I'm not sure on the cost. Well worth it in the end for sure! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nith Valley Sledder Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 We do a Landowner Appreciation Dinner eery year. All of our landowners and volunteers are invited Typical cost is around $1000 but we probably wouldn't have trails if we didn't do one. Just a cost of doing business, unfortunately. We are able to keep the costs in check by holding it in one of the local community halls (Legion, etc) and use the Ladies Auxiliary to cater. We do the same thing. It costs us about $700 and is money well spent. After sitting across from the landowner having supper and a beer we have a good relationship. Instead of the attitude of "I'm closing my property because everyone is wrecking my crops" we get the attitude of " We have a problem and how do we fix it". We regularly borrow one of their tractors or other equipment when needed and it is never a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogirl69 Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 I heard the clubs pay huge for crop damage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mossy Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 I heard the clubs pay huge for crop damage? Sometimes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
volunteer2 Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 I heard the clubs pay huge for crop damage? We have to pay the value. If it is huge damage we have to pay huge. Farmers feed cities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildman Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 We pay for a pancake breakfast for our land owners, the local firehall puts it on as a fund raiser, so it works well for everyone. I know of a couple wheat claims that are coming in, nothing big so far though. I think where there was damage this year it was so wide spread, it was obvious that there was far more problems then what the trail caused. That stuff would go through crop insurance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domino Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 Not sure why your guys are already complaining about refurbish money. Last year was a very good year and all payments to the districts under FFC was great. If your club still can't survive, maybe it's time to look at your clubs expenses. In my opinion, if there are clubs who were in the red, it's time to reorganize because it will not become better in the future. Thanks Greg That's a rosy picture that was made with water paint. Maybe the distribution of the district funds should not be left up to the District Governor! Once you give these people an option, most of them will distribute with Bias, not brains. Why is the OFSC so hell bent and thinking the FFC worked? And also, stop giving away family day weekend and we'll sell more permits. I'm tired of paying for 6 weeks of the year when the ONLY LONG WEEKEND of the winter is given away so that the trails are crap and the money we (the permit holders) paid is being wasted with extra grooming just to keep up with the free sleds. Maybe my area could have groomed longer if not for Family "Give the Trespassers a break" Weekend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reved Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 That's a rosy picture that was made with water paint. And also, stop giving away family day weekend and we'll sell more permits. I'm tired of paying for 6 weeks of the year when the ONLY LONG WEEKEND of the winter is given away so that the trails are crap and the money we (the permit holders) paid is being wasted with extra grooming just to keep up with the free sleds. Maybe my area could have groomed longer if not for Family "Give the Trespassers a break" Weekend Here here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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