OFSC at it again

[Canuck]

, majority vote through your local clubs voice is the way it's run....

As a rider, I was very impressed by the trails this year. Snow was sparse, but the trails were wonderful. Not sure why talk turns to politics in the off-season, but interesting issues were raised above. The insurance mail-out was a waste of resources. Having said that, if there was an opt-out I missed it. Will look closer next time.

The 'majority vote' statement above also leads to a question. What is the OFSC structure? I've heard of an Executive. Who votes for the Executive? Permit holders or, as the above implies, the local clubs chose??

I went to OFSC website to find something basic (who is on the Executive / President, VP, etc.) and couldn't find it. I looked into the question because the President of a 'way north' club I met in Feb. stated that the VP of OFSC was from my riding area. I wasn't aware of that, and wanted to follow up. I tried 'About Us' on the OFSC website and it directed me to the 17 Districts. Kinda accurate, because that is 'us'... but who is on the Executive/how are they elected, etc. This is by no means bashing - simply a question to better understand the system, which started innocently enough with a "Where you from?" on the 'A' trail.

If you're going to suggest I email OFSC, etc. I will. Just figured someone may know how to access the info on the OFSC website.

[Nutter]

As a rider, I was very impressed by the trails this year. Snow was sparse, but the trails were wonderful. Not sure why talk turns to politics in the off-season, but interesting issues were raised above. The insurance mail-out was a waste of resources. Having said that, if there was an opt-out I missed it. Will look closer next time.

The 'majority vote' statement above also leads to a question. What is the OFSC structure? I've heard of an Executive. Who votes for the Executive? Permit holders or, as the above implies, the local clubs chose??

I went to OFSC website to find something basic (who is on the Executive / President, VP, etc.) and couldn't find it. I looked into the question because the President of a 'way north' club I met in Feb. stated that the VP of OFSC was from my riding area. I wasn't aware of that, and wanted to follow up. I tried 'About Us' on the OFSC website and it directed me to the 17 Districts. Kinda accurate, because that is 'us'... but who is on the Executive/how are they elected, etc. This is by no means bashing - simply a question to better understand the system, which started innocently enough with a "Where you from?" on the 'A' trail.

If you're going to suggest I email OFSC, etc. I will. Just figured someone may know how to access the info on the OFSC website.

Here it is in a nut shell Canuck ....

Each club is it's own entity (Corp.), the local permit buyers elect the clubs exec through their involvement, same goes for associations and districts, but it's the majority vote of the clubs within the association or district is who elects the association and dist exec, not the individual permit buyer. The OFSC it's self is just an admin body which is governed by the clubs, through majority vote of it's members. The last say in anything and everything is at the hands of the permit buyer through their involvement.

Well I guess since I am a dedicated volunteer I must be talking about myself....

VOLUNTEERS ARE NOT THE OFSC!!! WE COULD HAVE TRAILS WITHOUT THE OFSC BUT NOT WITHOUT VOLUNTEERS.

Stop trying to twist this around as a personal insult, it is not. If the OFSC can be improved, or if they have made mistakes, volunteers or not, LISTEN!

This arrogance is going to drive people away from the recreational activity.

Take notes on the above post Dom, ask around within your club or other club members on here and tell me otherwise ... maybe you could tell us who you think the OFSC is ?

Well we would not want any misunderstandings, so this post has resulted in the OFSC link being removed from our website.

When the OFSC pays, we will re-instate it.

Knock yourself out Dom, it's your site ... so I take the OFSC was not a paying "sponsor", glad we got that sorted out, I certainly would think a sledding site called Ontario Conditions would be happy to put an OFSC link for free and not use up the resources of permit money, that so many here feel are being blatantly wasted at the hands of dedicated volunteer guidance .....

[skidooer]

Not sure why talk turns to politics in the off-season

Because it is fun, interesting, and informative to discuss these matters in a place open to anyone who wants to join in. It is unfortunate that a small handful like to chime in with their belief that only those at a club meeting are worthy of discussing the sport of snowmobiling, but I think everyone else understands the value of the discussions. I mean the worst thing that can happen is that we might learn something new while we have fun talking amongst ourselves.

I would like to take this opportunity to extend thanks to those club members who are willing to, and do enjoy, sharing their point of view. Being able to look at the issues from all sides, internal and external to OFSC operations, is what makes forums like this one great. What other place can one find so many degrees of insight?

[Nutter]

Not sure why talk turns to politics in the off-season

Because it is fun, interesting, and informative to discuss these matters in a place open to anyone who wants to join in. It is unfortunate that a small handful like to chime in with their belief that only those at a club meeting are worthy of discussing the sport of snowmobiling, but I think everyone else understands the value of the discussions. I mean the worst thing that can happen is that we might learn something new while we have fun talking amongst ourselves.

I would like to take this opportunity to extend thanks to those club members who are willing to, and do enjoy, sharing their point of view. Being able to look at the issues from all sides, internal and external to OFSC operations, is what makes forums like this one great. What other place can one find so many degrees of insight?

It's one thing to discuss and another to just out and out bash, as was my perception in both this topic and the radio add one. Questions could of easily been asked with out making unfound accusations of any finacial or ethical wrong doings. If there wasn't people available here to set the record straight, then what would people think of the OFSC ? Unfound accusations can great effect on opur outrside funding, and permit sales, thus effecting our trail system.

IE ...

Could someone give me some information about the insurance policy mail out ... Rather then "The OFSC is at it again"

Answer ..... The OFSC's paid employee marketing dept soliceted the sponsorship of an insurance company who paid the OFSC for the OFSC to include them in their marketing mailing list. This sponsorship and mail out program was approved by our our volunteer board of governors, who are elected by involved permit buyers. It was also endorsed by the volunteer president of the OFSC. All moneys raised through this were put into running the organization.

And

Why is it that there is still a permit radio add running ? ... Rather then "Your OFSC money at work"

Answer .... A deal was struck with Skywards media to get the OFSC a lot of extra free air time in very popular markets, this air time was already preset to run for certain length of time, but unfortunatly we lost most our snow well before the adds were put in place. The deal with skywards media was approved by our our volunteer board of governors, who are elected by involved permit buyers.

[02Sled]

Others have answered well to the post it's self ... But 02 I'm wondering about your opening sentence

"Well... they have done it again" ? Do you have some proof of the OFSC doing what you thought they just did before? If so what steps did you as a club volunteer try and take to rectify the situation so it wouldn't happen again ?

FYI to all who don't know ...

Along with club, association, district and provincial committee workshops and meetings, the OFSC annual AGM is open to each and every club member to attend, to voice their opinion and/or to just listen and educate themselves. All though in the case of the OFSC provincial AGM it is a club membership majority vote to whom carries the club membership vote and who is paid for by the club to attend, it doesn't mean one cannot attend and voice their own opinion where it counts and has effect. Not only is AGM the cornerstone of how the org is run, but it's also a chance for many to learn how the org is truly run (by membership vote). Many who attend do it on their dime, just out of the interest in being there, as not only is all that was mentioned but it's also a time for club volunteers/members from across the province to share in ideas on how we do what we do, and share in some like minded camaraderie, many bring their families and make it a weekend away with close to if not more then 1000 other dedicated sledders.

Hope to see some of you there :woot:

The reference to again is that they sent the same letter out in the fall. Yes I did make an effort to express my displeasure. Interestingly if you go to the OFSC website they have the Barrie office address but they don't have an email for the OFSC itself when you click on contact us. They make that part difficult. There are however a number of links to the different club emails and district emails. Last fall I expressed my concern to the district 7 email address and didn't hear anything back. I have once again done the same exercise a few days ago and once again didn't hear anything back.

This is what's always been at the bottom of the home page on the OFSC website, if you click the "contact us" tab you will open up a genreal e-mail window to the OFSC admin offic in Barrie, where they will read your e-mail and pass it on. Snailmail, E-mail and phone# info ... I don't see where "they make it hard" here ?

District Contact Information | Disclaimer | Privacy Policy | Contact US

© 2010 ONTARIO FEDERATION OF SNOWMOBILE CLUBS.

501 Welham Road, Unit 9, Barrie, Ontario, Canada L4N 8Z6 • Phone 705-739-7669 • Fax 705-739-5005

Best bet is to always address anything by starting at the club level and if majority agrees it is carried forward to the provincial level, The OFSC staff in Barrie can't do much of anything when it comes to policy matters as they are governed by majority vote, as cannot any one entity of the OFSC.

There's only so much time in the day, week, month, year to deal with frivolous complaints, some don't get answered just because of the nature of the complaint.

You copied the information from the OFSC website that I saw and tried to use to find an email for the OFSC.

District Contact Information | Disclaimer | Privacy Policy | Contact US

© 2010 ONTARIO FEDERATION OF SNOWMOBILE CLUBS.

501 Welham Road, Unit 9, Barrie, Ontario, Canada L4N 8Z6 • Phone 705-739-7669 • Fax 705-739-5005

There is amailing address and a phone number for the OFSC but not an email address for them. Not a fan of the phone call because phone calls are easy to ignore. Once you get off of the call there is nothing in front of you any longer to prompt you to pursue the situation and typically in the majority of situations where you try to deal with something on the phone you get told someone will call you back but they never do. With snail mail there is no record of anyone actually receiving your communication and you just wait for a response. I prefer email as do many in todays world of technology.

When you click on contact us there isn't an email address for the OFSC itself. Just links to the districts and clubs where you can find email for them but not for the OFSC. As a result I have sent my email to District 7.

Best bet is to always address anything by starting at the club level and if majority agrees it is carried forward to the provincial level, The OFSC staff in Barrie can't do much of anything when it comes to policy matters as they are governed by majority vote, as cannot any one entity of the OFSC.

There's only so much time in the day, week, month, year to deal with frivolous complaints, some don't get answered just because of the nature of the complaint.

From these comments you made it would seem that all the clubs voted and supported the sending out of the insurance solicitation. I can understand that there are policy decsisions that would be required to have alignment from the majority of the clubs but if decisions for something like sending out the letter regarding insurance and day to day business operations were left to the AGM then the OFSC would be totally ineffectual and really only need paper shufflers since day to day operating decisions would not be able to be made. The AGM would need to likely last weeks to address every possible situation. I can pictue it now BRP goes to OFSC with a proposal to provide a sponsorship to them worth a significant amount in exchange for their logo on the website. The OFSC says sorry... it will have to wait until next years AGM, you missed it two weeks ago.

As for frivolous complaints I object. You may see it as frivolous but I don't. While it may take time to get around to an answer every member should have the right to present a concern and eventually get a response rather than be ignored. I signed a form that I don't believe agreed to solicitation. Whether you agree or not this insurance is not a benefit it is solicitation veiled poorly as a benefit.

[UsedtoSkidoo]

Here it comes, wait for it......................wait for it...................

[Nutter]

Others have answered well to the post it's self ... But 02 I'm wondering about your opening sentence

"Well... they have done it again" ? Do you have some proof of the OFSC doing what you thought they just did before? If so what steps did you as a club volunteer try and take to rectify the situation so it wouldn't happen again ?

FYI to all who don't know ...

Along with club, association, district and provincial committee workshops and meetings, the OFSC annual AGM is open to each and every club member to attend, to voice their opinion and/or to just listen and educate themselves. All though in the case of the OFSC provincial AGM it is a club membership majority vote to whom carries the club membership vote and who is paid for by the club to attend, it doesn't mean one cannot attend and voice their own opinion where it counts and has effect. Not only is AGM the cornerstone of how the org is run, but it's also a chance for many to learn how the org is truly run (by membership vote). Many who attend do it on their dime, just out of the interest in being there, as not only is all that was mentioned but it's also a time for club volunteers/members from across the province to share in ideas on how we do what we do, and share in some like minded camaraderie, many bring their families and make it a weekend away with close to if not more then 1000 other dedicated sledders.

Hope to see some of you there :woot:

The reference to again is that they sent the same letter out in the fall. Yes I did make an effort to express my displeasure. Interestingly if you go to the OFSC website they have the Barrie office address but they don't have an email for the OFSC itself when you click on contact us. They make that part difficult. There are however a number of links to the different club emails and district emails. Last fall I expressed my concern to the district 7 email address and didn't hear anything back. I have once again done the same exercise a few days ago and once again didn't hear anything back.

This is what's always been at the bottom of the home page on the OFSC website, if you click the "contact us" tab you will open up a genreal e-mail window to the OFSC admin offic in Barrie, where they will read your e-mail and pass it on. Snailmail, E-mail and phone# info ... I don't see where "they make it hard" here ?

District Contact Information | Disclaimer | Privacy Policy | Contact US

© 2010 ONTARIO FEDERATION OF SNOWMOBILE CLUBS.

501 Welham Road, Unit 9, Barrie, Ontario, Canada L4N 8Z6 • Phone 705-739-7669 • Fax 705-739-5005

Best bet is to always address anything by starting at the club level and if majority agrees it is carried forward to the provincial level, The OFSC staff in Barrie can't do much of anything when it comes to policy matters as they are governed by majority vote, as cannot any one entity of the OFSC.

There's only so much time in the day, week, month, year to deal with frivolous complaints, some don't get answered just because of the nature of the complaint.

You copied the information from the OFSC website that I saw and tried to use to find an email for the OFSC.

District Contact Information | Disclaimer | Privacy Policy | Contact US

© 2010 ONTARIO FEDERATION OF SNOWMOBILE CLUBS.

501 Welham Road, Unit 9, Barrie, Ontario, Canada L4N 8Z6 • Phone 705-739-7669 • Fax 705-739-5005

There is amailing address and a phone number for the OFSC but not an email address for them. Not a fan of the phone call because phone calls are easy to ignore. Once you get off of the call there is nothing in front of you any longer to prompt you to pursue the situation and typically in the majority of situations where you try to deal with something on the phone you get told someone will call you back but they never do. With snail mail there is no record of anyone actually receiving your communication and you just wait for a response. I prefer email as do many in todays world of technology.

When you click on contact us there isn't an email address for the OFSC itself. Just links to the districts and clubs where you can find email for them but not for the OFSC. As a result I have sent my email to District 7.

Best bet is to always address anything by starting at the club level and if majority agrees it is carried forward to the provincial level, The OFSC staff in Barrie can't do much of anything when it comes to policy matters as they are governed by majority vote, as cannot any one entity of the OFSC.

There's only so much time in the day, week, month, year to deal with frivolous complaints, some don't get answered just because of the nature of the complaint.

From these comments you made it would seem that all the clubs voted and supported the sending out of the insurance solicitation. I can understand that there are policy decsisions that would be required to have alignment from the majority of the clubs but if decisions for something like sending out the letter regarding insurance and day to day business operations were left to the AGM then the OFSC would be totally ineffectual and really only need paper shufflers since day to day operating decisions would not be able to be made. The AGM would need to likely last weeks to address every possible situation. I can pictue it now BRP goes to OFSC with a proposal to provide a sponsorship to them worth a significant amount in exchange for their logo on the website. The OFSC says sorry... it will have to wait until next years AGM, you missed it two weeks ago.

As for frivolous complaints I object. You may see it as frivolous but I don't. While it may take time to get around to an answer every member should have the right to present a concern and eventually get a response rather than be ignored. I signed a form that I don't believe agreed to solicitation. Whether you agree or not this insurance is not a benefit it is solicitation veiled poorly as a benefit.

For general info e-mails to the OFSC click here, right under the tab to sigh up for the OFSC eNewsletter

Veile it anyway you want Gary, it's more money into the org ......

As I said the mail out was approved by the volunteer Board of Gov's, who carried the voice of their districts member clubs, which carry the voice of the involved permit buyer. It was brought up at dist meetings and a majority vote to support it approved it. If this was not brought forth to your club by your dist Gov then ask him why and demand such items are, as it's your org. And yes there are some day to day decisions that get made without a majority vote, but when signing any type of contract or cutting a check, approval is required from the volunteer Board of Gov's.

[UsedtoSkidoo]

and there it is!

[smokeater466]

Unfortunately, this type of forum allows those to bash, make unfounded accusations that don't make common sense and make it difficult to express wether they are merely asking a question or standing on a soapbox and throwing darts.

I thank the many dedicated volunteers who give countless hours to make the trail system what it is in Ontario. Without you there wouldn't be one. I am angered by the selfish attitudes of some who feel they have some sense of entitlement because they buy a pemit but wouldn't get off their ass to volunteer or attend a meeting to voice their concerns in the proper forum.

I realize that many of the permit dollars are spent wether it snows or not in preparing for the season and paying heavy liability insurance for the clowns whose own stupidity gets them into a jackpot then they want to sue somebody to cash in.

I am satisfied the OFSC did not spend money to send these letters out but rather made income and protected the personal information by handling the distribution of the material. Also with the radio ads that just how the media works and radio time gets played outside what would be the ideal target time frame. It appears the OFSC has gotten itself a hell of a good deal on the air time at local radio, television and the Weather Network.

Thanks again to our volunteers and don't worry about those who revel in throwing stones they don't represent the majority of members. Like every group there are always a few goofs.

[teener]

Unfortunately, this type of forum allows those to bash, make unfounded accusations that don't make common sense and make it difficult to express wether they are merely asking a question or standing on a soapbox and throwing darts.

I thank the many dedicated volunteers who give countless hours to make the trail system what it is in Ontario. Without you there wouldn't be one. I am angered by the selfish attitudes of some who feel they have some sense of entitlement because they buy a pemit but wouldn't get off their ass to volunteer or attend a meeting to voice their concerns in the proper forum.

I realize that many of the permit dollars are spent wether it snows or not in preparing for the season and paying heavy liability insurance for the clowns whose own stupidity gets them into a jackpot then they want to sue somebody to cash in.

I am satisfied the OFSC did not spend money to send these letters out but rather made income and protected the personal information by handling the distribution of the material. Also with the radio ads that just how the media works and radio time gets played outside what would be the ideal target time frame. It appears the OFSC has gotten itself a hell of a good deal on the air time at local radio, television and the Weather Network.

Thanks again to our volunteers and don't worry about those who revel in throwing stones they don't represent the majority of members. Like every group there are always a few goofs.

x2¹⁰

[skidooer]

Unfortunately, this type of forum allows those to bash, make unfounded accusations that don't make common sense and make it difficult to express wether they are merely asking a question or standing on a soapbox and throwing darts.

Remember that the only kind of person who would take the time to formulate a message directed at the OFSC and its volunteers is someone who deeply cares about the sport and those who are involved. Therefore, it is important to realize that bashing is impossible. Conveying a message succinctly can be quite a challenge to even those who are quite skilled with crafting of the english language, let alone those who are not. A message that may come across as bashing is never done with malice. It is just a message formulated to the best of the ability of the author at the time of writing to reach out and try and help the sport in the best way they know how.

[Wildbill]

The challenge is this . Where does the money come from to run what we have ? Some say they will pay more for a permit . The permits went up this year and sales went down drastically . The OFSC sold advertising to AIL . We got the letter and it fell in garbage but the OFSC still got paid . No harm done we through out lots of unwanted mail . As for the phone call we did not get one but if we did it would to disposed of quickly without any drama . But the OFSC still gets paid . I am good with this and do appreciate some of the funds that run the OFSC not coming out of the same pockets again and again.

[sledjunk]

The challenge is this . Where does the money come from to run what we have ? Some say they will pay more for a permit . The permits went up this year and sales went down drastically . The OFSC sold advertising to AIL . We got the letter and it fell in garbage but the OFSC still got paid . No harm done we through out lots of unwanted mail . As for the phone call we did not get one but if we did it would to disposed of quickly without any drama . But the OFSC still gets paid . I am good with this and do appreciate some of the funds that run the OFSC not coming out of the same pockets again and again.

Well said!

[02Sled]

The challenge is this . Where does the money come from to run what we have ? Some say they will pay more for a permit . The permits went up this year and sales went down drastically . The OFSC sold advertising to AIL . We got the letter and it fell in garbage but the OFSC still got paid . No harm done we through out lots of unwanted mail . As for the phone call we did not get one but if we did it would to disposed of quickly without any drama . But the OFSC still gets paid . I am good with this and do appreciate some of the funds that run the OFSC not coming out of the same pockets again and again.

Are you sure they got paid in cash which changes the complexion of the situation significantly or was the payment the free $3,000.00 ADD policy? Nowhere in the letter does it indicate that there was a sponsorship or cash provided.

[Wildbill]

I have it on good authority that indeed AIL paid well for this service

[skidooer]

Where does the money come from to run what we have ?

The OFSC is sitting on this incredibly valuable resource which they refuse to do anything with. There are so many money making opportunities there that it isn't even funny. They even had at least one volunteer willing to help improve upon it, once upon a time. But instead of excitement surrounding the idea of improvement, the ideas were met with fear and cynicism. Oh well...

[02Sled]

Where does the money come from to run what we have ?

The OFSC is sitting on this incredibly valuable resource which they refuse to do anything with. There are so many money making opportunities there that it isn't even funny. They even had at least one volunteer willing to help improve upon it, once upon a time. But instead of excitement surrounding the idea of improvement, the ideas were met with fear and cynicism. Oh well...

If they paid well into the OFSC coffers and the mailing information was retained within the OFSC I would reposition myself on this. I am in favour of anything that will bring cash flow into the OFSC and subsequently to the clubs and would be more than happy to assist with the same provided the confidential nature of the membership information was not compromised.

[Nutter]

Where does the money come from to run what we have ?

The OFSC is sitting on this incredibly valuable resource which they refuse to do anything with. There are so many money making opportunities there that it isn't even funny. They even had at least one volunteer willing to help improve upon it, once upon a time. But instead of excitement surrounding the idea of improvement, the ideas were met with fear and cynicism. Oh well...

What is this incredibly valuble resource that we refuse to do anything with ? Other then equip, clubhouses and groomer sheds all we have is the reserve fund, which is invested lighty so we can access it at anytime when needed. I bet there's 1000's of people with 1000's of great or better ideas, we'd just love have them present them, trouble is not many ever do ....

[Nutter]

Where does the money come from to run what we have ?

The OFSC is sitting on this incredibly valuable resource which they refuse to do anything with. There are so many money making opportunities there that it isn't even funny. They even had at least one volunteer willing to help improve upon it, once upon a time. But instead of excitement surrounding the idea of improvement, the ideas were met with fear and cynicism. Oh well...

If they paid well into the OFSC coffers and the mailing information was retained within the OFSC I would reposition myself on this. I am in favour of anything that will bring cash flow into the OFSC and subsequently to the clubs and would be more than happy to assist with the same provided the confidential nature of the membership information was not compromised.

I'm just really suprised you didn't learn this info through your club, association or district, or read about it in Main Trail ?

[Wildman]

Nutter, you need thicker skin dude. It is obvious how passionate you are about the ofsc, and that is all great, but you are not going to change too many minds here. If anybody is really serious about wanting their voice heard, they will follow the correct channels, and find that most of what you say is correct. Most people that complain on a forum of this sort, don't have the desire to really change anything themselves, but rather, hope somebody else will do it for them. Then you come along and play into their hand, every time something negative comes up about the ofsc. You do this on other forums as well.....just let it slide, like I say,if they really want to know,they will find out. You your self,or the other couple members here that always defend the ofsc will not change the bashers outlook, you haven't yet, and you won't.

[bbakernbay]

Yes Nutter will change some people's minds. Maybe not the author but his valuable background info certainly informs many of the 'viewers' who read the Forum topic but don't post.

without an effective counterbalance to some of this uninformed accusations there might be many more readers who feel that some of this allegations are in fact factual.

Nutter & others play a valuable role in trying to inform their fellow snowmobilers as to what is going on.

The OFSC is certainly not perfect but they do a great job in many regards.

The National Trails Council funding is a perfect example of how an effective head office and 17 Districts managed to get Federal & Provincial funding dollars for trails and get everything done within tight timelines and lots of regulations.

District 11 got over $400,000 in funding and the District hired a Project Manager to look after about 20 different trail projects. Everything was done before the deadline and hopefully we can access these funds next year.

[Doonut]

If everyone who spent time and effort whining and complaining about the OFSC and what it does spent 50% of that energy actually DOING SOMETHING about their complaint in the real world and not on internet forums, they would have a lot less to complain about.

I realize its the Canadian way. Don't vote but biotch and whine about the party that gets elected and how they see fit to run things. Somethings never change and never will.

Canadian apathy being way up there on the list.

[skidooer]

If everyone who spent time and effort whining and complaining about the OFSC and what it does spent 50% of that energy actually DOING SOMETHING about their complaint in the real world and not on internet forums

If we simply all of the arguments from both sides here, it basically boils down to:

Internet: "I want to help my local club and improve the OFSC as a whole but feel they make assistance inaccessible to the average person."

OFSC: "Join a club and you can make the necessary changes to make it more accessible for you."

Internet: "I appreciate your position, but if joining was accessible in the first place we wouldn't have this problem."

OFSC: "Maybe if you join a club you can fix the problem yourself."

Internet: "If you made this small change that took absolutely no effort on your part and would actually simply your operation more people could join and work to the maximum of their capacity."

OFSC: "We do it this way. Sorry if you don't like it. Why don't you join a club and help us out?"

Internet:

The clubs and their volunteers are, of course, free to run their operation as they see fit. Just the problem as I see it.

[Nutter]

If everyone who spent time and effort whining and complaining about the OFSC and what it does spent 50% of that energy actually DOING SOMETHING about their complaint in the real world and not on internet forums

If we simply all of the arguments from both sides here, it basically boils down to:

Internet: "I want to help my local club and improve the OFSC as a whole but feel they make assistance inaccessible to the average person."

OFSC: "Join a club and you can make the necessary changes to make it more accessible for you."

Internet: "I appreciate your position, but if joining was accessible in the first place we wouldn't have this problem."

OFSC: "Maybe if you join a club you can fix the problem yourself."

Internet: "If you made this small change that took absolutely no effort on your part and would actually simply your operation more people could join and work to the maximum of their capacity."

OFSC: If you'd like to come out to a meeting or give a hand on the trail we can discuss your idea and work with you first hand to better explain why it may or not work, as with out understaning more of the inner workings of our club, association, dist or the OFSC in general it would be very hard to explain this over the internet, as it is a volunteer organisation run by over 7000 volunteers from 231 clubs province wide, that provided 40,000 of temporary seasonal trail,much of which is on private granted access land.

The clubs and their volunteers are, of course, free to run their operation as they see fit. Just the problem as I see it.

:poke:

[UsedtoSkidoo]

I cant believe it!