vooodooo Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 (edited) Impossible for a snowmobile IMO. To put it in perspective, there is about 33 kwh in a gallon of gas, but much of that goes out the exhaust or to waste heat. A tesla 85kwh battery weighs 1200 lbs. 10 gallons of gas weighs 70 lbs, so even at %10 efficiency, that is 33 kwh @ 70 lbs. Fact is a car rolls, sleds need the power applied much of the time to keep it moving. That 1200 lb battery would be depleted in a matter of hours. Sorry to burst the bubble. Edited March 29, 2021 by vooodooo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vooodooo Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Turbo Doo said: While I think saving the planet and all is great, let's not put the cart before the horse here. Let's get cars and trucks electrified first, and the grid built to handle that, which will be a very long time coming, then if that all goes to plan, move to recreational products. I can see it happening, but to have the entire sport, gonna be a while imo. Ontario freaks out on a hot muggy day in July or August for hydro, let alone all this added to the system. Ontario used to max out our supply of power. Think it was around 27 or 28 GW. The only realistic way to beef up the grid for electric cars is small modular nuclear reactors, in the location of demand. That ain't gonna happen. Plan B is removable, standardized battery configurations. Charged off site, brought to a "filling station" You'd lease the battery, swap it out at now what are changing stations. That's doable, and in the works, but years away. Many factors are involved in that. Batteries and the power to drive a vehicle. The laws of electrical design haven't changed. Voltages required and the cables etc. are quite complex. It ain't like swapping out the starter battery on the F150. Edited March 29, 2021 by vooodooo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildman Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 2 hours ago, signfan said: Come on. You were quitting over covid too. If they give you a 180 hp monster that is quicker off the line than the new mach z you'll be all over it. Lol. If and when the charging infrastructure is in place I'm all in. Small scale nuclear needs to play a big role in transforming the power grid. We need something to use up the spent fuel that already exists. The future is coming. We all have a choice. Move forward or stick our heads in the sand. My kids want to snowmobile. Keep going the way we are and the Ohio weather we have in district 5 will make its way to district 15. This tech can't come soon enough. GM's on board, BRP too. Lots more to come. going electric will never change the earths relationship to the sun and it will not make magnetic north true north. It is called a cycle, no mater what government appointed environmentalists tell you. My head is no where near stuck in the sand and I ain't drinkin the koolaid either. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildman Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 1 hour ago, 02Sled said: I remember about 2005 we were looking at trying to add to our power feed to our data centre. York Mills and Don Mills area. Toronto Hydro told us it couldn't be done since the infrastructure in the area was already at capacity and there weren't any plans to upgrade the already very old components. Now imagine trying to add chargers for thousands of cars. for a while there some municipalities were not issuing building permits unless a 50A circuit for car charging was on the blueprint. I haven't heard much about that lately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revrnd Posted March 29, 2021 Author Share Posted March 29, 2021 3 hours ago, signfan said: Come on. You were quitting over covid too. If they give you a 180 hp monster that is quicker off the line than the new mach z you'll be all over it. Lol. If and when the charging infrastructure is in place I'm all in. Small scale nuclear needs to play a big role in transforming the power grid. We need something to use up the spent fuel that already exists. The future is coming. We all have a choice. Move forward or stick our heads in the sand. My kids want to snowmobile. Keep going the way we are and the Ohio weather we have in district 5 will make its way to district 15. This tech can't come soon enough. GM's on board, BRP too. Lots more to come. Nuclear I'm pretty sure thats a non-starter in Canada. Too many NIMBYs would shoot down that idea. Heck the usual suspects want Pickering & Darlington closed sooner rather than later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revrnd Posted March 29, 2021 Author Share Posted March 29, 2021 On 3/27/2021 at 3:50 PM, signfan said: True, but those brand new Skandics and expeditions are selling somewhere. I was thinking of southern Ontario (Simcoe, Scubog & the Kawarthas). Mind you if you can afford to put a fairly new F150 on the bottom of Simcoe, you can afford a decent sled... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sledguy74 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 1 hour ago, revrnd said: Nuclear I'm pretty sure thats a non-starter in Canada. Too many NIMBYs would shoot down that idea. Heck the usual suspects want Pickering & Darlington closed sooner rather than later. Darlington shouldn’t be shut down anytime soon we just refurbished unit 2 and now starting unit 3 unit 2 is back online making power for another 25-30 yrs Pickering keeps getting extended but will be decommissioned eventually We are also starting the refurbishment of unit 6 at Bruce Power. both Darlington and Bruce have expressed interest in new builds ontario knows it need to replace the power from Pickering but no clear direction yet 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revrnd Posted March 30, 2021 Author Share Posted March 30, 2021 7 hours ago, Turbo Doo said: Electric sleds. I'll be done with the sport, if that ever takes over. And I thought I'd never own a 4 stroke 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revrnd Posted March 30, 2021 Author Share Posted March 30, 2021 1 hour ago, Sledguy74 said: Darlington shouldn’t be shut down anytime soon we just refurbished unit 2 and now starting unit 3 unit 2 is back online making power for another 25-30 yrs Pickering keeps getting extended but will be decommissioned eventually We are also starting the refurbishment of unit 6 at Bruce Power. both Darlington and Bruce have expressed interest in new builds ontario knows it need to replace the power from Pickering but no clear direction yet Thanks! I lived slap dab between 2 of them & never thought twice about them. I can hear it now, "If Ontarians would curb their hydro usage, we wouldn't need nuclear..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
signfan Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 3 hours ago, Wildman said: for a while there some municipalities were not issuing building permits unless a 50A circuit for car charging was on the blueprint. I haven't heard much about that lately. It was in the Ontario bldg code for a few years. You had to put provisions in (empty conduit) for a single dwelling and multi units I'm pretty sure had to actually install the chargers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
signfan Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 4 minutes ago, revrnd said: And I thought I'd never own a 4 stroke Exactly This fits the bill if the stage 3 charging infrastructure gets built. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://m.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3D0MBU5NQjRNM&ved=2ahUKEwjXnNfd6dbvAhX9GVkFHfYeDX4QwqsBMAB6BAgDEAM&usg=AOvVaw1Qa7ACJXkYkdlzs24qOUvG No more than enough, but a great first start. It has to get to the point that you're buying it for the performance vs the environmental benefits to go mainstream. The orca I think already does that in the pwc market where range is less of a concern. For cottagers on a land locked lake it's a no brainer. Private dockside charger means no more lugging jerry cans to the dock. The sleds probably still have a step to make. Need a 200 km range and a trail side charging network. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildman Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 when GM and Ford announced that they would be completely electric by 2035 er 40, whatever it was Elon Musk was crying that north american infrastructure would only support 15% of the vehicle market to be electric. The other thing nobody considers is the price of plastic, if refining companies are not selling as much gas n diesel, do you really think polyethylene will remain at a sustainable price......this stuff is not rocket science, it's a greenie pipe dream, people that have absolutely zero clue in what is involved in a true carbon footprint. I'd like to see nothing but electric planes for these jackrods to fly around in, that would make me sleep like a baby. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revrnd Posted March 30, 2021 Author Share Posted March 30, 2021 We can also look @ the law of diminishing returns. The progression of snowmobile tech 25:1 premix 50:1 premix Oil injection EFI DFI 4 Strokes When our family started sledding in '70 the Old Man was dumping a quart of oil in every 5 gallon can. Now I do 1 only change a year & my sled probably gets much better fuel mileage than a 335 cc single. It would be interesting to see how much the carbon footprint has been reduced & what will be accomplished in a limited sized market (snowmobiles) will have in the 'fight against' climate change. If sometime down the road I need a little econobox to go to Ptbo & back, that's fine as its a finite route. Same as electric delivery vans, they go back to a central location at the end of the day & are charged up the next morning. I can't imagine a banzai run to the Corridor hauling the sled(s) when you have to stop halfway to charge up the sleds. Or will domestic travel be a thing of the past? Someone asked me what my thoughts were on Greyhound after the pandemic. I said I doubt this run (3 days a week between Toronto & Pembroke) would return. If Trudeau & Wilkinson think they're going to convert Canada to this green utopia, I think they're smoking something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildman Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 I agree with the advancements. I just don't see the majority running electric stuff. There are huge hurdles to overcome, I think allot of dreamers are selling the hurdles short, JMO. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbo Doo Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 10 hours ago, revrnd said: We can also look @ the law of diminishing returns. The progression of snowmobile tech 25:1 premix 50:1 premix Oil injection EFI DFI 4 Strokes When our family started sledding in '70 the Old Man was dumping a quart of oil in every 5 gallon can. Now I do 1 only change a year & my sled probably gets much better fuel mileage than a 335 cc single. It would be interesting to see how much the carbon footprint has been reduced & what will be accomplished in a limited sized market (snowmobiles) will have in the 'fight against' climate change. If sometime down the road I need a little econobox to go to Ptbo & back, that's fine as its a finite route. Same as electric delivery vans, they go back to a central location at the end of the day & are charged up the next morning. I can't imagine a banzai run to the Corridor hauling the sled(s) when you have to stop halfway to charge up the sleds. Or will domestic travel be a thing of the past? Someone asked me what my thoughts were on Greyhound after the pandemic. I said I doubt this run (3 days a week between Toronto & Pembroke) would return. If Trudeau & Wilkinson think they're going to convert Canada to this green utopia, I think they're smoking something. Green Utopia, was the passing of the legalization of Marijuana bill, right?. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revrnd Posted March 30, 2021 Author Share Posted March 30, 2021 1 hour ago, Turbo Doo said: Green Utopia, was the passing of the legalization of Marijuana bill, right?. I saw on the news ticker last night a cannabis company is laying off staff after shifting production to exclusively indoors. Since legalization, how have the companies fared on the market? Companies seemed to be popping up everywhere but analysts said the long term health of some of these companies was iffy. I wonder if there was a huge over-estimation in the market? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sledguy74 Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 (edited) 16 hours ago, revrnd said: Thanks! I lived slap dab between 2 of them & never thought twice about them. I can hear it now, "If Ontarians would curb their hydro usage, we wouldn't need nuclear..." I sat through a webinar last week with hybrid power designs for the "future".........some nuclear with wind, solar and natural gas back up as a top up. Everyone wants zero C02 yet they want to still have diesel or natural gas as a backup/top up......seems foolish IMO So in theory on nights where there is no wind you would be using nuclear and the fossil fuel generators.....why not use a bigger nuclear power source and drop the generator?? >50% of Ontario is CANADIAN nuclear power, it is disappointing they don't build more of the same proven technology. Other countries seem more interested in using CANDU technology than Canada. Yea sure the upfront price may have a sting to it but divide it out over 50-60 years and its pretty economical for reliable power. Again IMO. I think BRP is doing the right thing to invest now in EV technology, i suspect its more towards CanAm vehicles focus over Ski Doo but who knows. Edited March 30, 2021 by Sledguy74 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snapper Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 6 hours ago, Turbo Doo said: Green Utopia, was the passing of the legalization of Marijuana bill, right?. It garnered many votes for Captain Crunch. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowchopper Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 (edited) Edited March 30, 2021 by snowchopper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowchopper Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 ^^^^Lesters just posted this a little while ago.Thought you might find it interesting.^^^ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revrnd Posted March 31, 2021 Author Share Posted March 31, 2021 8 hours ago, Sledguy74 said: I think BRP is doing the right thing to invest now in EV technology, i suspect its more towards CanAm vehicles focus over Ski Doo but who knows. (well it is yellow LOL) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revrnd Posted March 31, 2021 Author Share Posted March 31, 2021 TD's next half ton: 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catinental couch Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 Not sure what Mrs. TD is going to think about riding to Cochrane in that!! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowchopper Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 9 hours ago, revrnd said: TD's next half ton: Just needs a sled deck lol.... 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbo Doo Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 9 hours ago, revrnd said: TD's next half ton: 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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