viperpilot Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Hi everyone. I am new to this forum and was referred here by someone on the Totallyamaha forum. My brother and I are booked on the snow train leaving the Sault on March 1st. We have never ridden in Ontario so I need to some help planning this trip. Should we only go to Hawk and start from there, or should we bite the bullet and take it all the way to Hearst? If we do go to the end of the line, which way should we go? Thru Cochrane, Timmins, and Chapleau, and around that way? Or should we go the other way thru Hornepayne and Wawa and hown thru half way haven? Originally I really wanted to try to get up to Abiti canyon but I'm not sure why - I guess cuz it looks cool on the map and in the pics. Anyway, right now we are thinking of going all the way to Hearst and riding back over 4-5 days thru Timmins, but I guess it really depend on the local conditions, etc. It would really help me out of some of you that have experienced these trails and trip could offer some advice and/or share stories. Thanks very much - we are really excited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Help you will get here. It may be a little slower coming on weekends as most of the critters are sledding but you will get all the info that you need .Welcome to OC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skidooboy Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 how many days do you have to get back to the soo? you could do either, the choice is yours... ride the train to hawk and ride the trail to dub, then to hornepayne (roughly 135 miles). then hornepayne to cochrane. then cochrane to chapleau, and chapleau back to the soo. if you have an extra day loop to the canyon. but if you dont the above isnt bad. or you can train to hearst, and start there doing the same thing. not trying to knock the train but, here is another option to get more trail miles, start in the soo (searchomont of heyden) and loop the whole region without the train. then you get to see what all of northern ontario can offer. soo (searchomont)to wawa 170 miles wawa to hornepayne to hearst 250 hearst to timmins 225 timmins to chapleau 175 chapleau to soo (searchmont) via the F trail and d106 200 ski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viperpilot Posted February 21, 2009 Author Share Posted February 21, 2009 Ski- thx for the feedback. We want to take the train to check it out, just part of the adventure I guess. If we go to hearst, which way back would you recommend? Are the trails a lot different if you go the one way (thru timmins) versus the other (wawa)? What about the towns and nightlife, etc? Also, it it reasonable to leave from Cochrane, do the Canyon, and then get to Timmins, or is it better to stay in Cochrane again? We can put 150-200 miles a day on in the Western UP, but I am not sure what that equates to on the Ontario trails. Is a 250 mi day doable? I appreciate you taking the time to respond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skidooboy Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 cochrane to canyon and back is a one day deal. you can do 250 no problem but you wont see much just a white blur and gas stations. not much fun like that in my opinion but, it is your trip. i like to mix days up, 175-200 tops. but thats me. i wanna play, see things and take my time to enjoy what is there. that is why we go back so often. i am assuming you have a whole week off so here goes. if you wanna train and dont want to miss an area here is an idea. leave friday night drive to soo you can sleep saturday on the train as it is a 10+ hour ride. train to hearst day one (companion hotel, sleds unload from the train in their lot, and they have heated indoor storage, good way to start the trip.) hearst to cochrane day two (lillabelle lodge is a great choice from what i hear) canyon run day three (lillabelle again) cochrane to chapleau day four (valentine farms) chapleau to wawa via missanabi (ernie burger dont miss it),and dubreuilville (stop at the quickie mart and see luc the groomer guy) (best northern or wawa motor inn) best northern is owned by the wawa sled club vice prez and is on the south side of town with quick access to the south trail to halfway haven and have great food. day five wawa to the soo. day six drive home on day 7. then you have sat and sunday to relax at home and remember the trip before you go back to work. here's a link and a report from a few weeks ago i know the guys that went on this less the train, they did it reverse of your loop plan but you get the idea. viewtopic.php?f=10&t=3923 we will be in dubreuilville starting thursday night (late) march 5th. riding friday, sat, and sunday. might cross paths. if you have more questions just ask. ski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ox Posted February 22, 2009 Share Posted February 22, 2009 The train ride through Agawa Canyon is werth seeing. So the ride to Hawk wouldn't be totally in vain... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viperpilot Posted February 23, 2009 Author Share Posted February 23, 2009 Thx for taking the time to respond with all the input ski. You said to take the train on Sat but I think it only goes on Sun, no? We will leave Hearst Mon first thing and do as much of what you said as possible. We are excited to see what Ontario is all about. Sounds like you really have it down so if there are any other tricks (can't miss places to eat, stops where you MUST get gas, etc) or anything else you have up your sleeve I am all ears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ox Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 I was thinking the same - that the train only runs north every other day. I didn't know if Yammiboy actually did his homewerk and search the departure dates or was shooting from the hip??? The "Snow Train" to Agawa Canyon and back to the Soo runs every day - but the one going to Hearst goes north one day and back south the next. FWIW - I have never loaded my sled on the train, but I always fealt that if I was to doo the tour that most folks doo that way - I would want to ride out of the Soo and load up if/when I decided I was done. Point being - that if you had a dead sled - you could tow to nearest rail and drag it on board. I am sure that they will load along the tracks in a need be situation. Especially if your in Hawk or .... ???? But I aint never done it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viperpilot Posted February 23, 2009 Author Share Posted February 23, 2009 OX, that is a good point. The other nice thing is that after a whole day int he car to get there you've got the itch to ride, and you don;t need to wait another whole day - you just end up with the two days on the back side. With regard to your comments, my grand master plan was that if we end up with problems we can always take the train back if we have to, but this gives us more flexibility in the long run as we do not have to be at the station on a particular day to get back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyzer Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 2008/09Winter Schedule In Effect November 5, 2008 to May 4, 2009 NorthBound Wednesday/Friday/Sunday Eastern Time Departure Sault Ste. Marie 9:00 a.m. Arrival Hawk Junction 2:40 p.m. Arrival Dubreuilville 3:30 p.m. Arrival Hearst 6:40 p.m. SouthBound Thursday/Saturday/Monday Eastern Time Departure Hearst 8:00 a.m. Arrival Dubreuilville 11:00 a.m. Arrival Hawk Junction 11:30 a.m. Arrival Sault Ste. Marie 5:40 p.m. Adult Fares (19+) Fares In Effect January 1, 2009 Sault To: 1-way CDN Return CDN Hawk Junction (Zone 3) $65.30 $130.60 Dubreuilville (Zone 4) $89.10 $178.20 Hearst (Zone 6) $136.60 $202.00 Senior Fares (60+) Fares In Effect January 1, 2009 Sault To: 1-way CDN Return CDN Hawk Junction (Zone 3) $59.40 $118.80 Dubreuilville (Zone 4) $80.80 $161.60 Hearst (Zone 6) $123.50 $202.00 Child/Youth Fares (5-18) Fares In Effect January 1, 2009 Sault To: 1-way CDN Return CDN Hawk Junction (Zone 3) $51.10 $102.20 Dubreuilville (Zone 4) $68.90 $137.80 Hearst (Zone 6) $104.50 $125.00 Shipping Charges Snowmobile/Sleigh Snowmobile CDN Up to 3 Zones (1-way) $83.00 More Than 3 Zones (1-way) $101.00 Hearst Round Trip $184.00 Sleigh CDN Up to 3 Zones (1-way) $41.50 More Than 3 Zones (1-way) $53.45 Hearst Round Trip $83.00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revrnd Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 Last Sunday night in Hearst, some sleds loaded up for the Monday return to the Soo, but I don't think any sledders unloaded. The year we went, we took the train up & sledded back to the Soo & our motel. We didn't have to go back to the station upon our return as we had taken our rig back to the motel & cabbed it back before our departure. Be aware there is no trail access to the station in the Soo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FINNDIAN Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 I've never taken the train but what I ussually hear from most that ride is it was it's very long and they wish they were riding. I think if I did it I would ride up from the soo and eventually take the train back either from Hearst or even better get on in Hawk Junction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ox Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 Does this rail not stop/go through Hornpayne? OX, that is a good point. The other nice thing is that after a whole day int he car to get there you've got the itch to ride, and you don;t need to wait another whole day - you just end up with the two days on the back side. Just how long does it take you to git to the Soo? I'm commin from Ohio (barely) and I can make the Soo easy enough in 6 hrs. ??? And what's this aboot a "car"? What's that? Like an ElCamino or something? :carsled: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skidooboy Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 ox, tracks in hornepayne are cn freight tracks. they are not the same tracks for the snowtrain/tracks to trails. an sorry, i didnt search the info on the train, went from what it was in the past. i remember from years past, friends getting on the train on sat and running to halfway haven after getting dropped at hawk. (sorry for the confusion and misinformation) i'm with jonesy, i'd rather be riding than sitting and watching 3-5 feet of snow i could be riding on, goin by my window. but again that is my opinion. (have been slammed in the past for suggesting this). either way you will have a great time. this is the only place i ride, wouldnt ride anywhere else. we live in michigan and ride and support the northern ontario area because of what it has to offer everyone. ski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
700renegade Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 Been there / done that train things a few times. I come up from Wisconsin. Here is my thoughts. Start riding in Searchmont the first day, and do your big loop counter clockwise. Toughest part is Chapleau to Timmins ( tighter twisty trails ). If you can do 200 miles in UP you can do 300 in Ontario per day. I'd ride out the loop and end at either Hearst OR Hawk Junction, depending on whether you do the canyon or not, etc. ( canyon loop is only 1/2 day +, not a full day ). You can only get your sleds loaded at Hearst / Hawk and Soo to my knowledge. Taking the train at the end of the trip is very relaxing and a way to recharge before your long drive home. Take some food and beers as not much if anything is on the train. Best part of train is south of Hawk anyway, so skip the piece from Hearst to Hawk if you can. Be aware of which days the train departs. At Searchmont jump off the train by the general store ( just tell the conductor and they let you off anywhere ) - you sleds will stay on the train. You can drive your truck from Searchmont to Soo and get to the station before the train does to get the sleds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viperpilot Posted February 23, 2009 Author Share Posted February 23, 2009 No, you are right Ox, it's a Tahoe not a car. I am coming from Chicago but keep my sleds in the Western UP. Have to pick up my brother in Grand Rapids, MI. So there has been quite a bit of orchestrating that has gone in to planning this little ditty. So maybe you guys are right and we will flip the trip around and take the train back. Am I going to need reservations at the places we are going to stay or do you think I will be able to take it day by day here during the week? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ox Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 ox, tracks in hornepayne are cn freight tracks. they are not the same tracks for the snowtrain/tracks to trails. I know that is a major CN hub there - as well as sported the last (?) indoor roundhouse in use in North America up untill just a few yrs ago. (OK - maybe 8-9 yrs ago - but who's counting eh?) You can find links to that via the Hornpayne page I think. And you guys - you MAY even be able to git a tour if you check into it! I guess this line here would go 20-30 klicks east of town to be a straight shot from Hawk to Hearst eh? (w/o git'n a map out...) Well - YEAH! I know where that comes out at! That's where the old Hearst/Hornpayne trail usta cut into the bush at - maybe 20 klicks or so S of Hearst! So i'd be more like ... good grief ... 100 klicks east of Hornpayne? (I know where I'm at - just gotta think aboot it once in a while... ) Best part of train is south of Hawk anyway, so skip the piece from Hearst to Hawk if you can. S of Hawk the topography makes a nice landscape - and you will go through Agawa Canyon. I don't think the freight train will stop in the canyon tho. ??? Be aware of which days the train departs. And make sure which way it's going if you load in Hawk! I am coming from Chicago but keep my sleds in the Western UP. Have to pick up my brother in Grand Rapids, MI. So there has been quite a bit of orchestrating that has gone in to planning this little ditty. Good grief..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viperpilot Posted February 23, 2009 Author Share Posted February 23, 2009 Been there / done that train things a few times. I come up from Wisconsin.Here is my thoughts. Start riding in Searchmont the first day, and do your big loop counter clockwise. Toughest part is Chapleau to Timmins ( tighter twisty trails ). If you can do 200 miles in UP you can do 300 in Ontario per day. I'd ride out the loop and end at either Hearst OR Hawk Junction, depending on whether you do the canyon or not, etc. ( canyon loop is only 1/2 day +, not a full day ). You can only get your sleds loaded at Hearst / Hawk and Soo to my knowledge. Taking the train at the end of the trip is very relaxing and a way to recharge before your long drive home. Take some food and beers as not much if anything is on the train. Best part of train is south of Hawk anyway, so skip the piece from Hearst to Hawk if you can. Be aware of which days the train departs. At Searchmont jump off the train by the general store ( just tell the conductor and they let you off anywhere ) - you sleds will stay on the train. You can drive your truck from Searchmont to Soo and get to the station before the train does to get the sleds. Renegade - these might be dumb questions. If we do decide to sled up and ride back on the train, I assume you can leave your vehicle in Searchmont? Why does everyone say to start in Searchmont as opposed to the Soo - traffic, or bad conditions, or what? Is it reasonable to make it from Searchmont to Valentine Farms in one day on a Sunday? I am thinking: Sunday - Searchmont to Chapleau Monday - Chapleau to Cochrane Tues - Cochrane to Abiti, Back to Cochrane Wed - Cochrane to Hearst Thur - Hearst to Wawa Fri - Around Wawa Sat - Train from Hawk Back Is this reasonable or are we going to be killing ourselves? I figure this gives us a contingency day as well, and if we are beat we can always take the train back from Hearst Thur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ox Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 If you park in Searchmont - you will want to park @ Driftwood Valley Cabins. It's a pay to park situation where your truck would be a bit safer. (And 1/2 the walk from the depot! ) When you git into town to cross the river and then the second rd to the rt should be "Whitman Dam Rd" and you wunna take that rt. Go back acrost the river (baily bridge) and then the rd snakes left and you will see their sign on the rt side of the rd. No reservations needed unless you are wanting to use a cabin for the night. If so - I can post his phone number for you as well. From there to Chap will be enough for a first days ride prolly. Adding the distance from the Soo would make it lengthy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FINNDIAN Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 if you want to go from searchmont to Valentine farms in one day you may want to take the wilderness trail from halfway haven to chapleau which would give you about a 150mile day. If you go into wawa you'd be looking at probably over 300 miles, 150 to wawa 50ish to missinabie and 100ish to chapleau. You can also stay at ernies in missinabie, he has a house he rents out to snowmobilers that is supposed to be a nice place to stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viperpilot Posted February 24, 2009 Author Share Posted February 24, 2009 I think we've got it figured out. I have tried every which way to figure out how to ride from the Soo and take the train back from Hawk but the Thurs/Sat only return really screws it up. So, here is what I am thinking: Sat Night - Stay at Water Tower Inn Sun - Train to Hearst - Companion Mon - Hearst to Cochrane - Lillabelle Tues - Abiti Canyon Loop to Timmins - not sure, help me out Wed - Timmins to Chapleau - Valentine Farms Thurs - Chapleau to Wawa via Ernies for a burger - Wawa Motor Inn Fri - Wawa to the Soo - headed home So I need to you guys that have logged some miles up there to tell me, is this very doable, or am I over extending myself? Are there any tricks regarding gas on these routes that I need to know so we don't get in to trouble? Any other place besides Ernie's that we need to eat or stop? Finally, is there a site where you can down load the maps in to Garmin? You guys have really been great and are a wealth of info. If you will be up in those parts next week we will be on a Black Attack and a Silver Rage, and would love to catch up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FINNDIAN Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Looks like a good loop. You should have plenty of time. Your days are mostly easy days the longest probalby being timmins to chapleau and wawa to soo, never did the canyon so not sure on that one, but trails are pretty staight and uneventfull timmins to hearst. When we ride that loop we ride hearst to timmins in one day. Have fun and stop in when your in wawa. Gord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revrnd Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 I don't think you'll have a problem doing the Canyon Loop. Spoke to some guys @ Lillabelle & the west side of A103 north of SRF is flat & straight. Twistier, flat & wide on the east side (only side we've ridden yet). I think in a earlier thread this winter, some guys were going to run from Lillabelle, do the loop then head west to Kap when they found out the Moose Motel was closed in SRF. SRF to Timmins is 75 miles. Be aware of 2 stretches of log hauling on TOP C south of TOP A & the Hwy 655 road crossing west of the C/A106C jct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ox Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 but trails are pretty staight and uneventfull timmins to hearst. AND HOW! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
700renegade Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 Hey Ox - is Reggie ( the guy just north of the store ) in Searchmont gone? I always used to park there - seems like I recall he had his house for sale last year. Viper- you seem like you are on track for a good trip now. Easy enough schedule unless you get too many Lablatz Blue in you some night. I sent you a pm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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