Spiderman
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Posts posted by Spiderman
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Speaking only from my own observations, the enforcement I have seen via the OPP has really been more focused on licence, val tags, ownership and insurance checks, which to me, really, doesn't do much of anything to deter reckless or careless riding - which is what is leading to the demise of trails.
Landowners aren't closing trails because a guy didn't update his val tag, or doesn't have a drivers licence, or didn't purchase a pass either.
Trails are being closed because of idiotic driving habits/actions.
I have seen the odd radar out there- pretty much only on the Seguin, but aside from that, I haven't seen anything in the way of enforcement which would do a single thing to "save our trails". To that end, I also don't want to see too much of that, because if I had to cruise at around at 50km/hr or less all day, it would not be enjoyable and I would probably just ride the lake anyway to have more fun, without the limitations.
It's pretty much an impossible balancing act
Just my own 2 cents.
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28 minutes ago, Turbo Doo said:
While it's much appreciated, it's useless without enforcement...
True, but it needs to come from within too.
We can't expect Police and/or people with enforcement power to be everywhere at once - catching people riding off trail etc.
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Seems a bunch in here is are jaded.
I guess further to my point before - if you're seriously that angry and pissed off about it - then quit.
Life is too short to spend it being pissed off and angry.
You really have one of two choices
A. Stay in - do what you can and what you feel is right for the activity ( understanding you're efforts may fall on deaf ears - but you SHOULD be able to lay your head down at night comfortably knowing you made an honest effort ), enjoy the great days you do get to have and learn to be okay with it - while it's still there to enjoy......
or
B. Quit - sell your stuff - quit - and have nothing.
I know what it is for me
My sled has come out of the garage less than 10 times in the last 5 years - but it's still there - it's ready to ride, and it will always be there.
I don't envision a day where I don't have a sled - even if it's at a point where all I can do is grab a hand full of throttle and go down the lake - that never gets old for me - it's like I am 12 again every time I can do that.
Good luck on your decision - but choose wisely and in a clear frame of mind.
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yeah, no way, stay out of it and stay anonymous.
2 years from now you'll be getting served with a Statement of Claim.
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4 hours ago, Nunz said:
Did an interview with Ctv news yesterday,
take a watch.
Good stuff.
Can't imagine trying to run a business reliant on weather and being allowed to actually be open.
Support those people!
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Un-called for and completely disrespectful, no other way to sugar coat it.
Don't let other peoples piss poor actions drive you away from something you love though.
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My daughter was out on the lake and in a field yesterday - snow looked good.
We're heading up this weekend for some riding - can't wait!
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Was going to head up and try to ride lakes and fields this weekend - but going to give it one more week.
Will Muskoka even get open this year?
come on mother nature - throw us a bone here
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1 hour ago, Krusty said:
Just spoke with the groomer operators in Baysville & they are out packing as I write this. With the cold the swamps are all froze up but there is still a lack of snow. With the terrain in that area, there needs a fair amount of snow to fill in the holes that they just don't have yet. They are also doing some brushing as well. Once some more snow comes things will happen quickly as the initial packing & brushing is well under way.
My assumption is our area is in a similar state - and it isn't going to snow at -30......
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1 hour ago, stoney said:
Knock on wood, we have never had issues either - of course you always heard about this and how theft can be bad, I always wondered if it is one of those tails that tends to get exaggerated.
I don't get people worried about parking their stuff for a few days here and there or overnight, yet they'll park expensive toys at their un-attended cottages for long stretches without a concern...
Just go - crap happens
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I would think so - but is there any snow on it?
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Was looking at our club's Facebook page - so many downed trees.
We have the low lying swamp issues too - it's been nice and cold with little snow - so hopefully those have firmed up.
No hockey for the last 3 weeks - but no snow to ride at the cottage either.... stinks
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11 hours ago, Ox said:
Hard to believe that they are actually settling this that quickly.
Usually it seems that they allow a bit of time to see if it pops up first?
Unless they just know from experience that if these doo pop up, it will be a year from now or more on average?
Used to be 30 days.
I guess times have changed.
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tough/late start - great to see the dedicated volunteers staying optimistic and doing what they can.
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6 hours ago, RAMSOMAIR said:
You got that right. But if there is a 2022 sitting beside a 2021 and the thieves know DESS doesn't work on the 22 (oh and they know)........
They aren't worried about DESS, they'll steal anything and everything.
Thieves and their "fencing" market will always have a way to move whatever is they need to move.
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Well, thieves don't need to start the sled to steal the sled
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9 minutes ago, Nutter said:
The MSVA applies to anywhere public including lakes, crown and municipal land, and on private land where the public is invited to ride by fee, and/or if enforcement is requested by the land owner, however on roads and hwy's it's up to the discretion of the officer to enforce under the HTA or MSVA. I was made aware of this from ride alongs with Sean (ODot1)
Appreciate the clarification
Cheers
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49 minutes ago, infernobuster said:
Just an FYI. The HTA was changed in Sept of last year to include all private entities as well.
ie parking lots etc. I dont think that includes snowmobile trails with the exception of road running, or alongside a highway. Again, up to officer interpretation.
Yup, saw that - the change followed the ruling on the case I posted.
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5 minutes ago, Nutter said:
If you're talking about Quebec we'd need to see huge legislative changes, here volunteers, landowners, clubs the OFSC and birds that fly over trails can be sued, Sure we win just about every single time, but in order to do that there us a huge cost burden, which Quebec doesn't have with their lawsuit protection legislation. The OFSC and every other none profit in Ontario has lobbied for it for as long as I can remember, out legal system isn't budging on it. Quebec is much different culturally especially when it comes to sledding, but they also have a lot of the same issues.
Sometimes the only solution to a problem has to come from within the problem itself ........
100% - their no right to sue law(s) is the biggest saving grace
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20 minutes ago, stoney said:
Yes, OFSC trail passes through from K to little Red, but I doubt there was a sled clocked at 120KM on that section based on what I recall that trail was like.....likely down the main road out of base camp.
And 120km may sound like a lot, but a sled gets up to that in the blink of an eye that we all know the vast majority of usually are not that far off that mark on a straight section of trail.
yeah, that's about 75 miles an hour - doesn't take long to hit that at all.
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25 minutes ago, PISTON LAKE CRUISER said:
There are OFSC prescribed trails on the Halibuton Forest property. As well, many of the OFSC trails in Ontario are on private property annd the MSVA apply to them.
I didn't know there were OFSC prescribed trails in the Haliburton Forest.
Sorry, to clarify, MSVA applies to OFSC prescribed trails only
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18 minutes ago, PISTON LAKE CRUISER said:
Thanks to the gentleman that sent the following definition of "Trail" as used in the MSVA.:
Definition of Trail in section 1 of the MSVA.
“trail” means the whole of any trail established and maintained by a recreational organization for the use of motorized snow vehicles; (“piste”)
I think that the above definition would apply to the H.F. even though they are a for profit org.
One thing that stands out for me in the news report is that the headline that indicates the radar stop took place on an OFSC trail. If that is indeed the case, there are no OFSC trails open in that area and so there should have been trespassing charges laid.
The article says "in Haliburton Forest" - which are NOT OFSC prescribed trails.
The MSVA does not apply to private property
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9 hours ago, tricky said:
So you don't believe the Haliburton Forest Facebook comment that they use paid duty OPP to police their trails? OFTR/SCORRA use paid duty OPP to police their trails. Makes some sense to me that Haliburton Forest would budget for some police patrols.
Well, people can say anything they want - I would probably say the same thing in an effort to keep people honest.
I would also welcome them in, it's a win win
We have an area in my city that "paid" duty are used - it's not voluntary - it's forced on the business owners via a levy as part of their licences - it's very very expensive.
I wouldn't want to see the bill for having two Paid Duty OPP's riding around for the day - but maybe for them it's worth it to keep people in check.
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18 minutes ago, Nutter said:
Some things to ponder within the scope of some of what's been discussed in this thread.
The me me me generation is only getting worse, respect for one another for the most part is gone, not just in sledding. Everyone got a trophy whether they put forth an effort or not, so here we are ...........
30,000 km of trail in the province each trail with multiple access points - if trail closed signs were put up and removed at every access point each time a trail opened and closed throughout the season what would cost of the signs and logistics be, and how many volunteer hours would it take each time ? Also what kind of liabilities would it open if the odd sign here and there was missed if this was the standard practice ?
Mid to late 40's Ted and Alice just want to help their community and volunteer with their local sled club because it's their way of giving back through something they enjoy in their spare time. How much training and legal protection can you feasibly give to them to be effect Trail Patrol, and most importantly at the same time keep them from harms way ?
Last season a group of 6 of us were trailside on a rail trail at an open area at a road crossing, checking permits and chatting with riders that stopped because they wanted to stop and chat. 90% of the riders were totally awesome just out riding and enjoying the day, posing for pic's for the clubs FB page, and also taking pic's themselves, very receptive to us being out there. We also helped a couple with a mechanical problem and saved their day. After about an hour or so a group of 4 guys came up upon us at an overly high rate of speed fast enough that their stopping was uncontrolled, almost clipping some of us and others pulled well off the trail. When we and some of the others that were at the stop tried to confront them while they made their stop at the road crossing, they were belligerent and extremely aggressive, one guy actually got off his sled and starting flexing and chirping off to everyone there. Pic's were taken and OPP were called and description and reg numbers were given, there was a snow unit out in the area, but never heard back from them, so figure they never saw them. This wasn't the first time something like this has happened to our group. I like most other volunteers I just want to ride and volunteer to make sure we have trails and to help better my community. I deal with aggressive scumbags at work all the time and have a decent amount of confrontation de-escalation, self defense and tactical training, and I honestly no longer feel safe out there doing trail patrol in the bush with sketchy cell service, and certainly don't want to have to deal with that crap while volunteering.
I don't know the solution, but do feel the only thing that will save this sport (and mankind in general) is a shift in the attitude of the select ME ME ME few. No matter how much the fines are, or if the OPP put 10-20x the amount of man power out there it will never be enough to stop the self entitled a-hos.
Change has to come within the sport, like Zozo said, people have to stop doing things like riding with people with unpermitted sleds. Also take it a few steps further, not riding with people that ride with cans, or riders riding beyond their talent.... ect
All makes sense
OFSC Issues Urgent Appeal To Save Our Trails - Jan 24/22
in Main Clubhouse
Posted
Yeah, but is it the biggest ticket/fine - because it would seem to me the focus is on assigning $ and a subject line to the ticket that supports ........