manitouwadge club, officially no longer part of the OFSC.

[skidooboy]

It appears that last years club set back, has spilled to this year, and possibly a permenant situation. the ofsc has sent the official letter that the club is no longer affiliated with the ofsc, and they are to come and retrieve all the assets that havent been taken as of last season.

this is a sad situation for the region, the community, and the touring sledders as a whole. once again there will be another HUGE HOLE in the trans ontario top trail system in northern ontario.

this community has limited resources as most smaller communities in the region. the volunteers that were/are left are over burdend, under funded, worn out, and too few to continue to groom, sign, sell permits, process paperwork, and be able to work at their own jobs, and or enjoy the trails they would provide in their limited spare time. this area has little to no commerce, and dwindling hope.

it seems this is the same story over and over in the north. it is a sad state of affairs. hopefully there is a light at the end of the tunnel at some point.

but, it appears for this region the large loops are a thing of the past and the clubs that have local loops, local funding, and an influx of tourism from these loops, and neighboring communities working together to keep this type of commerce alive, will be the only thing left in the north in the winter months. instead of looping and over nighting town to town, it looks like for the time being, you will be needing to trailer and day ride in these areas IF you can find lodging.

pray for the north and all our friends up there. ski

[FreezerBurnt]

that is too bad

When I drove by there in 2008 , the trails looked very nice and the scenery was top notch

[DWIGHT RX]

Manitouwadge was one of my favorite destinations, remote and beautiful. Met some very nice local sledders that helped us out one long Sunday afternoon. This is really a blow to the touring riders.

[couchrocket500]

That's awful! Never sledded there but always wanted to. Researched the area many times but just never seemed to have the time to committ. This is occuring way too often these days.

[AC+YA]

End of last season we rode from Dub to Hornepayne and then stayed in Hillsport. The next day after a big snow, we ran to Geraldton and back to stay in Hillsport. There is some wild country and the snow was real deep last year. Running untouched roads south of Caramat we found that you need to respect the deep stuff because you will have to stop sometime.

This is all great country and the loops we use to make down through Manitouwadge to Marathon and then back through White River to Dub were great. Conditions stopped us from returning until last year and now until when?

I miss the trails and the people were always helpful and friendly like those running the Hillsport Hilton last season. They too were from Manitouwadge.

[skidooboy]

i am unsure of the status of hillsport trail, or if the longlac, and hornepayne clubs will groom that trail as they did last year. as i have said about the D trail between the sault and wawa, the F trail between elliot lake and aubrey falls.... KNOW BE FORE YOU GO! check the conditions, if the trail is opened, groomed, signed, AND if there are accomodations AND OR fuel along the way AND at your begining and ending destinations.

i am really hoping someone doesnt get injurered or, left out in the cold (LITERALLY), due to older maps and not checking before they go because, "they always go there".

ski

[Canuck]

A sincere thanks to the members in that community who made the area available for sledding to date.

It's interesting that in this era of reliable sleds and greater daily distances, we're getting cut off from the outer edges of our trail system.

[The Groomer Guy]

Il have more info on the trails situation in the area in a few more weeks, will keep you guys updated.

[Ox]

[Canuck]

Is that manitouwadge?

If so, what a powerful photo.

Almost like our last view of this community (from a sled).

[skidooboy]

yes, that is the "mountain" over the town of manitouwadge. if you can get up there before the sun comes up, the sunrises are spectacular. ski

[Wildbill]

This is not an OFSC created problem it is an Ontario created problem thanks Dalton

[couchrocket500]

This is not an OFSC created problem it is an Ontario created problem thanks Dalton

How so WB?, there is much I do not understand about the north.

[slomo]

Has nothing to do with Dalton, but more to do with location and world economy. You can't fully understand the situation in northern Ontario until you've done a bit of driving and visiting that way. That way you can come to grips with the isolation and distances between communities and the fact that one-industry towns are doomed to suffer when demand for their product lessens.

Manitowadge has done as much as it can by spending advertising dollars on making itself an 'outdoors' recreation area - sleds, atvs, hunting, fishing, etc. but it is beyond the driving range of most people in populated areas with discretionary income.

Here's a solution to think about....get a hardy bunch of sledders in their retirement years to spend a couple of months a year in Manitowadge, D'ville, Wawa etc keeping the trails open ...good living, fresh air, better than average chance of snow.

[02Sled]

It is a problem created largely by McSquinty. In the debate he claims Ontario created more jobs than the rest of the country this year. Not tough to do when Ontario represents almost 50% of the Canadian population and the jobs are mainly part time service industry jobs. Not something you can live off of. At the same time we lost significant numbers of full time jobs. He doesn't mention that part.

McSquinty chose not to attend the northern debate which was only attended by Tim and Andrea.

How is he killing the north? You mention one industry towns. Primarily the north is either mining or timber. The McSquinty Fiberals have screwed with the mining and timber allocations as to who can take what from where without any regard to the consequences it will have on the lives of the people who have been there for generations.

Some pin headed beauracrat is destroying towns and the lives of those that live there without any conscience.

I wonder if someone from the north who moves to the GTA could be considered an immigrant and get a job courtesy of the Fiberals $10,000.00 tax credit to the firm that hires them. Probably not though since they were born here. We are not special enough to receive that kind of help. Just those who have lived here 5 years or less.

[The Groomer Guy]

wonder if someone from the north who moves to the GTA could be considered an immigrant and get a job courtesy of the Fiberals $10,000.00 tax credit to the firm that hires them. Probably not though since they were born here. We are not special enough to receive that kind of help. Just those who have lived here 5 years or less.

Good one

[The Groomer Guy]

District 16 have big challenges but it needs to help its self too, Im from the area and well over the years i've seen stuff. I don't want to cause any crap, just saying..... just with the signs, remember the first years of the the new sign policy, we took down the BAD signs, cheveron's and the curve signs, well the the district 16 club next to us was saying they had better signs than us. told them they need to take down those signs.... I even told the op director on a sled ride, weeks later I go back and instead of taking down the bad signs....... they put up even more!!!!!!! WTF? when I told the op director on the trail about the sign on the trail while on the trail he said " there's nothing wrong with the signs" what????? U you don't get the same signage policy than us?????? I guess its different from district to district. If you cant work, do little things like that, Imagine the big stuff.

[Wildbill]

It is a problem created largely by McSquinty. In the debate he claims Ontario created more jobs than the rest of the country this year. Not tough to do when Ontario represents almost 50% of the Canadian population and the jobs are mainly part time service industry jobs. Not something you can live off of. At the same time we lost significant numbers of full time jobs. He doesn't mention that part.

McSquinty chose not to attend the northern debate which was only attended by Tim and Andrea.

How is he killing the north? You mention one industry towns. Primarily the north is either mining or timber. The McSquinty Fiberals have screwed with the mining and timber allocations as to who can take what from where without any regard to the consequences it will have on the lives of the people who have been there for generations.

Some pin headed beauracrat is destroying towns and the lives of those that live there without any conscience.

I wonder if someone from the north who moves to the GTA could be considered an immigrant and get a job courtesy of the Fiberals $10,000.00 tax credit to the firm that hires them. Probably not though since they were born here. We are not special enough to receive that kind of help. Just those who have lived here 5 years or less.

Bingo well said

[dweese]

This is not an OFSC created problem it is an Ontario created problem thanks Dalton

Why is this Dalton's problem? What about Harper? If we are just going to blame the government for everything, make sure you include everyone.

For all we know, its flat out the clubs issue, maybe they where running a shady operation or not wiling to follow the rules, and the OFSC shut them down because of this.

The world is in a slow down and things like selding get hit first, but if your looking to point fingers at someone, forget our government. You should be thankful we did as well as we have during all this. Take that finger (the middle one) and point it south, at the US and how their changing of banking and stock trading rules alowed things to fall apart. Be thankful your not living in a places like Grease or Iceland, countries that are basicaly bankrupt.

Doesn't matter who was in power in Ontario or Ottawa, things still would have still fallen apart.

[Canuck]

Here's a solution to think about....get a hardy bunch of sledders in their retirement years to spend a couple of months a year in Manitowadge, D'ville, Wawa etc keeping the trails open ...good living, fresh air, better than average chance of snow.

Not a bad idea.

Hopefully, a 'solution' will prevail sooner, rather than later.

The longer trails stay closed, the harder they will be to open.

Quite frankly, I'd like to see OEM's subsidize trails (or at least provide operational support) to a higher degree. If we're cut off from longer rides, we certainly won't purchase as many sleds.

[dweese]

Quite frankly, I'd like to see OEM's subsidize trails (or at least provide operational support) to a higher degree. If we're cut off from longer rides, we certainly won't purchase as many sleds.

That would be a good idea or how about you just sell the sled that is built in Montreal at the same price as you sell it in the US. Why are BRP sleds $1000-$2500+ more down the road from where they are built than in a different country? Why is a BRP boat $30k here and only $22k in New York state?

[Canuck]

That's the question many of us have been asking, DW.

I see OEMs assisting motorcycle associations to a greater degree.

Sure would like to see some funding for trails.

Take the extra $$$ - but help out a club, or two.

[skidooboy]

For all we know, its flat out the clubs issue, maybe they where running a shady operation or not wiling to follow the rules, and the OFSC shut them down because of this.

Why on earth would you even type something like this? what if someone typed YOU were the shady one, and YOU were the one that caused the failure of the manitouwadge club, with no basis of fact?

get my point? dont type what you dont know, and dont stir the pot just to see your words in print.

the mani club did nothing wrong. they were super small, had very few people willing to buy permits, even fewer interested in helping the club. they told the ofsc that they no longer had the funds or manpower to maintain their (the ofsc's) top trail last season. the district came and retrieved their groomer last year. this year, it was no different, no one willing to step up to brush, sign, groom, sell permits, process paperwork, advertize ect... for the approximate 300 miles of TOP and district trails around them.

with no hotel, and limited bed and breakfasts for lodging, they couldnt draw people into the area to stay. so everyone just passed through on their way to or from geraldton/longlac, hornepayne, marathon, white river ect... they were a key stop on the superior loop challenge, now, they dont have any lodging (or trails) to have more than sledders pass through. and now that too is lost.

the only reason i posted this was to make sledders aware, so someone doesnt get to a dead end trail, or somewhere there is no fuel, lodging food ect... and gets injured or worse because they didnt plan ahead, and they were using older maps.

as far as the retired people going and doing this.... at retirement age, how long do you think anyone could work, brushing, signing, grooming, maintaining equipment, at -30 or-40 degrees???? young, healthly people have a hard enough time putting that kind of labor in.

what is being brought to light in this club closure is... an all volunteer system works great when you have volunteers. but there is a difference between volunteering and being forced to do something with little or no compensation for the benefit of another group wether it is a user group, or a for profit or non profit organization.

and with the weaking economy (and yes it is still getting worse and can get alot worse to come), unfortunately this is just the start of the failure of little clubs, and more trail closures. our sport cant sustain it's existance without an influx of new blood, and an overhaul of the user pay system. ski

[couchrocket500]

Here's a solution to think about....get a hardy bunch of sledders in their retirement years to spend a couple of months a year in Manitowadge, D'ville, Wawa etc keeping the trails open ...good living, fresh air, better than average chance of snow

Great idea slmo, I think I would even consider. Yet I fear that this would only be a short term solution to the problem of decreasing local population.

How is he killing the north? You mention one industry towns. Primarily the north is either mining or timber. The McSquinty Fiberals have screwed with the mining and timber allocations as to who can take what from where without any regard to the consequences it will have on the lives of the people who have been there for generations

I agree 02Sled. Ontario has depended far too long on manufacturing subsidized to a large extent by a very low dollar. I suppose the same can be said for tourism although N Ontario is so unique it will always enjoy tourism but to what extent?. I have very limited knowledge of mining or timber. Is the timber and ore just harvested and shipped "raw" out of province/country for process? If so, a lot of potential Ontario jobs go with those raw products I would think. Jobs that could help the north survive? Do these timber and mining allocations go to off shore interests? I can't help but to compare this with Syncrude's proposed pipeline from N. Alberta to the Gulf Coast, that Harper for some reason or other favours. From my understanding the bitumen is upgraded just enough to pipe, yet will require further upgrading before it meets near conventional standards fit for refining. How many jobs go with that crude only to have the finished stuff sold back to us? Wonder if this occurs with timber and mining in N. Ontario.

I believe Canada's natural resourses are the future for Canadians to prosper. What else is there? Our governments should be encouraging the private sector to upgrade refine whatever here in Canada rather then shipping raw materials out of the country.

I don't know if this is what's happening in the north But I suspect it may be so.

[Canuck]

The TOP trail system should be a priority (IMO)

Interestingly, I've met folks with a completely opposite opinion - namely, work on trails that GTA riders / Muskoka riders use because they get utilized and forget about the northern trails.

Every ski resort has 'peak' trails that few utilize, due to difficulty. They don't groom halfway up the hill, and neither should we.