Air tabs on v-nose enclosed

[signfan]

Anybody tried these?

 

http://www.airtab.com/how-do-they-work.htm

 

Gimmick or great idea?  If it works should be a standard option in the Triton catalog.

[revrnd]

We have seen them on the odd trailer. I've messaged a trucker friend about them. We have discussed them after seeing them on the trailers in the past. I have seen them on the 'cab extensions' on the tractors, but not much on trailers. I think these:

 

But then again they're more noticeable.

 

I think some Subaru models have them at the rear edge of their roof as well.

[signfan]

Yeah can't see the wings working on an enclosed sled trailer.  They would be a pain.  These air tabs seem like a much better idea if they work.

[revrnd]

5 hours ago, signfan said:

Yeah can't see the wings working on an enclosed sled trailer.  They would be a pain.  These air tabs seem like a much better idea if they work.

Just got off the phone with my trucker friend. He said the company he drives for (large Canadian transport company) had 20 or so trucks delivered new with the tabs attached. That was several years ago. For whatever reason subsequent orders haven't included the tabs.

 

LOL on the wings on a sled trailer.

[Gadgetman]

My opinion, and we all know about opinions; but having worked with engineers in fluid dynamics in the past, what my learning was that sure these items work in the engineering sense of the fluid dynamics, but pay back or value requires many many miles, i.e trucking companies, whose trailers are always on the road justifies the $200 for a trailer set. I'd suggest that for most of us that only trailer a few times a year, I'm not sure you will get value.

Now, you being on a V nose, or a Triton 167 narrow, compared to my Triton clam shell, which is like a parachute, that I have seen the fuel consumption savings with.

 

Again, just my opinion, and I accept my opinion could be full of "malarky".

Cheers

Edited May 18, 2021 by Gadgetman

[revrnd]

@Gadgetman My friend said you could put x number of drivers in identical rig/trailer combinations & the mileage results would be all over the place.

 

He said the big thing in helping mileage is reducing the turbulence between the tractor & the trailer (hence the cab extensions). Long wheel base 'large cars' might look cool, but if pulling a dry van, it really hurts the mileage.

[Turbo Doo]

My opinion,  a waste.  If your interested in these for fuel savings,  your in the wrong sport.  If your interested in these for venting,  better options imo. 

[revrnd]

I think the fact that they AREN'T commonplace, proves their ineffectiveness. If they worked, the fleets would have embraced them a few years ago.

[signfan]

7 hours ago, Turbo Doo said:

My opinion,  a waste.  If your interested in these for fuel savings,  your in the wrong sport.  If your interested in these for venting,  better options imo. 

Venting?  Stability and just simply making your rig pull easier I thought looked interesting.  Nothing worse than fighting pulling over hills.  I've found that my 3000 lbs boat and trailer combo pulls better than the sled trailer at half the weight with 2 sleds on it.  It's not terrible mind you, but for $200 if the drag is cut out of the equation it would be worth the effort and minimal cost.

[signfan]

7 hours ago, revrnd said:

I think the fact that they AREN'T commonplace, proves their ineffectiveness. If they worked, the fleets would have embraced them a few years ago.

Good point.  The trucking industry is kinda like construction though.  Slow to embrace change.

[revrnd]

3 minutes ago, signfan said:

Good point.  The trucking industry is kinda like construction though.  Slow to embrace change.

My friend did say though that some companies have been quick to adopt the trailer skirting. He says they aren't cheap. 

 

I guess it all depends on the loads as well. A truck pulling a dry van of packages (lighter) would likely be more conducive to saving fuel than 1 maxxed out with a load or plywood.

[Strong Farmer]

 

6 hours ago, signfan said:

Good point.  The trucking industry is kinda like construction though.  Slow to embrace change.

They can just put a fuel surcharge on load anyways, so consumer pays. 
Every load of shavings I get out of Quebec has a 450 dollar fuel surcharge on it. Been that way every since diesel hit a dollar a litre. 

[PISTON LAKE CRUISER]

8 hours ago, signfan said:

Good point.  The trucking industry is kinda like construction though.  Slow to embrace change.

I think that was the case for many decades but trucking is adapting to change quicker in the last decade than ever before. Fuel is the second highest cost for truck operators after driver costs. Companies are looking for cost savings wherever possible and because fuel is such a big part of variable costs it is a target for cost reduction.

Fuel economy has been on a relatively steady increase over the last number of years. Speed Limiters are part of that increase but fuel saving devices have also played an important part.

[Gadgetman]

8 hours ago, signfan said:

Venting?  Stability and just simply making your rig pull easier I thought looked interesting.  Nothing worse than fighting pulling over hills.  I've found that my 3000 lbs boat and trailer combo pulls better than the sled trailer at half the weight with 2 sleds on it.  It's not terrible mind you, but for $200 if the drag is cut out of the equation it would be worth the effort and minimal cost.

I find with the clamshell, that if the sleds are loaded in the trailer or not, fuel consumption jumps from about 9L/100km to about 18L/100KM (2016 Highlander), add a brisk headwind  (20L/100KM). What I did notice once in the rain was that the bull nose front pushed so much air down on to the road way that it cleared the water off the road (mostly).

Over the years I've thought about installing front snap type cover so that the front platform doesn't accumulate snow, I expect a secondary effect would be less parachute effect between the nose and the trailer v deck.

If you opt to go for it, let us know your results.

[Turbo Doo]

I've found that my '20 PR Triton, pulls alot better, and is alot more stable then our TC167,  or clamshell ever was. Just my opinion..

[revrnd]

2 hours ago, Strong Farmer said:

 

They can just put a fuel surcharge on load anyways, so consumer pays. 
Every load of shavings I get out of Quebec has a 450 dollar fuel surcharge on it. Been that way every since diesel hit a dollar a litre. 

Have you heard who Tobler & Sons hauls to? See their trucks thru all the time. I'm assuming they're getting shavings from the mills in Bancroft, Whitney & possibly Madawaska. Something to look into.

[Turbo Doo]

7 hours ago, revrnd said:

Have you heard who Tobler & Sons hauls to? See their trucks thru all the time. I'm assuming they're getting shavings from the mills in Bancroft, Whitney & possibly Madawaska. Something to look into.

They run north alot also. I've seen them alot near the intersection of Hwy 11, and Hwy 631...

Edited May 19, 2021 by Turbo Doo

[revrnd]

27 minutes ago, Turbo Doo said:

They run north alot also. I've seen them alot near the intersection of Hwy 11, and Hwy 631...

Before I saw them around here (a recent development) I'd see them on 69 south of Sudsbury.

[Ox]

9 hours ago, Strong Farmer said:

 

They can just put a fuel surcharge on load anyways, so consumer pays. 
Every load of shavings I get out of Quebec has a 450 dollar fuel surcharge on it. Been that way every since diesel hit a dollar a litre. 

 

I fired a truck lines for this.

"Surcharge" has been WAY over abused!

 

Katrina hit in '05 eh?

Fuel was $4 US for nigh on 15 yrs after that!

And somehow $4 fuel still demands a surcharge?

Couldn't find time in the last dozen years to update the cost/mile fee and just roll it into the cost of dooing business?

 

Then the price of fuel finally started dropping, and even got down to pre '05 rates, and yet there is still a "Fuel Surcharge"?

REALLY pisses me off!

 

Then one day a trucking company (steel hauler) decided that it was a good idea to save $ on postage, and they started e-mailing the invoices.

Well, those come into MY 'desk, not mamma's post office box.

For the most part I don't handle the money here in over 20 years, but now that some of the invoices come into my desk now - that helps me to know what's what.

 

Well the bill for a 1/2 load of steel coming out of Chi Town had what seemed like a big surcharge to me, so I did the math.

 

I don't recall the numbers anymore, but the surcharge was enough to have paid for every drop of fuel used to propel that truck from Chi-Town to my door, and I only had half the load. I'm sure the other guy was going to be paying even more yet as he is further down the pike yet.

 

So then - what is the "baseline" for fuel, that the surcharge is added to?

 

I found a new trucker. I don't care that he is cheaper or not, just call a spade a friggen spade and don't try pullin' any fast ones!

If it costs $5/mile to run that rig, then bill $5. Not $2.40 with a huge rider on the side! (out of proportion values, just emphesis)

[catinental couch]

2 hours ago, revrnd said:

Before I saw them around here (a recent development) I'd see them on 69 south of Sudsbury.

They were hauling salt out of the Parry Sound salt docks in the winter. As far as I know, they were going north with all or most of it. 

[Strong Farmer]

5 hours ago, Ox said:

 

I fired a truck lines for this.

"Surcharge" has been WAY over abused!

 

Katrina hit in '05 eh?

Fuel was $4 US for nigh on 15 yrs after that!

And somehow $4 fuel still demands a surcharge?

Couldn't find time in the last dozen years to update the cost/mile fee and just roll it into the cost of dooing business?

 

Then the price of fuel finally started dropping, and even got down to pre '05 rates, and yet there is still a "Fuel Surcharge"?

REALLY pisses me off!

 

Then one day a trucking company (steel hauler) decided that it was a good idea to save $ on postage, and they started e-mailing the invoices.

Well, those come into MY 'desk, not mamma's post office box.

For the most part I don't handle the money here in over 20 years, but now that some of the invoices come into my desk now - that helps me to know what's what.

 

Well the bill for a 1/2 load of steel coming out of Chi Town had what seemed like a big surcharge to me, so I did the math.

 

I don't recall the numbers anymore, but the surcharge was enough to have paid for every drop of fuel used to propel that truck from Chi-Town to my door, and I only had half the load. I'm sure the other guy was going to be paying even more yet as he is further down the pike yet.

 

So then - what is the "baseline" for fuel, that the surcharge is added to?

 

I found a new trucker. I don't care that he is cheaper or not, just call a spade a friggen spade and don't try pullin' any fast ones!

If it costs $5/mile to run that rig, then bill $5. Not $2.40 with a huge rider on the side! (out of proportion values, just emphesis)

You should have seen no back haul

available surcharge when covid first hit and everything got shut down last spring. It was over double the fuel

surcharge. Lucky I got an estimate and said no thank-you and call me when you have a back haul available. I am on a main highway just outside of Kitchener, not in boonies. Sure enough they call back a week later and said they had a back haul. That would have added 1g Canadian to load. Who knows if they would even run empty all way back to Quebec. Hard to believe nothing available in Toronto that could go to Montreal or Quebec City. The shavings plant I order from is just outside of Quebec City too. 

[PISTON LAKE CRUISER]

9 hours ago, Strong Farmer said:

You should have seen no back haul

available surcharge when covid first hit and everything got shut down last spring. It was over double the fuel

surcharge. Lucky I got an estimate and said no thank-you and call me when you have a back haul available. I am on a main highway just outside of Kitchener, not in boonies. Sure enough they call back a week later and said they had a back haul. That would have added 1g Canadian to load. Who knows if they would even run empty all way back to Quebec. Hard to believe nothing available in Toronto that could go to Montreal or Quebec City. The shavings plant I order from is just outside of Quebec City too. 

Do your shavings arrive bagged or bulk?

[Strong Farmer]

14 hours ago, PISTON LAKE CRUISER said:

Do your shavings arrive bagged or bulk?

Out of Quebec it is only bags. No bulk service in ontario. Wish there was, since only in Quebec you can get virgin product, that is screened in bulk, just like bags. 
Here in ontario bulk Is hit and miss with quality and fines depending on where it is coming from. I don’t like saw dust and bio security in bulk from secondary sources like furniture manufacturers isn’t best. 
They put 45 bags on a skid and weather wrap it for me with two layers of heavy plastic. Designed to be stored outside until needed. 26 skids on a truck with a total weight of around 42,000 pounds. Never get that on a bulk truck either. 
 

[revrnd]

1 hour ago, Strong Farmer said:

Out of Quebec it is only bags. No bulk service in ontario. Wish there was, since only in Quebec you can get virgin product, that is screened in bulk, just like bags. 
Here in ontario bulk Is hit and miss with quality and fines depending on where it is coming from. I don’t like saw dust and bio security in bulk from secondary sources like furniture manufacturers isn’t best. 
They put 45 bags on a skid and weather wrap it for me with two layers of heavy plastic. Designed to be stored outside until needed. 26 skids on a truck with a total weight of around 42,000 pounds. Never get that on a bulk truck either. 
 

http://glenislefarms.com/about-us.html

 

They're out of Keene & haul from the mills north of here. Not sure how far they'd haul to.

[PISTON LAKE CRUISER]

9 hours ago, Strong Farmer said:

Out of Quebec it is only bags. No bulk service in ontario. Wish there was, since only in Quebec you can get virgin product, that is screened in bulk, just like bags. 
Here in ontario bulk Is hit and miss with quality and fines depending on where it is coming from. I don’t like saw dust and bio security in bulk from secondary sources like furniture manufacturers isn’t best. 
They put 45 bags on a skid and weather wrap it for me with two layers of heavy plastic. Designed to be stored outside until needed. 26 skids on a truck with a total weight of around 42,000 pounds. Never get that on a bulk truck either. 
 

So, I believe they can haul that in a 53' tandem van which should give them the best opportunity to get a back haul into Montreal and areas beyond.