Turbo Doo Posted December 23, 2020 Share Posted December 23, 2020 1 minute ago, Muskoka Bill said: Based on my understanding and if lockdowns don't change then you should be able to go assuming the locals including the Health region director have not Mandated a restriction and you do the social distancing ... stuff. The decision becomes a moral one of traveling from a locked down region to a non locked down region. I have not seen anything that say's I can't travel at this time. People are flying to destinations for the holidays, but there's problem traveling in your own province, come on.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbo Doo Posted December 23, 2020 Share Posted December 23, 2020 9 minutes ago, stoney said: So taking a trip end of Jan, when the restrictions are let up I see...wink, wink, nudge, nudge.... I am optimistic that the season will be able to carry on, lots of lip service though that will be heard & read.....will it be different, no doubt, but I think and hope it will still be a season, one that will be remembered no doubt. Cup is half full...for now Makes the most sense right?. But i am most likely sure the lockdown will be extended. So essentially what 'they' are saying is, trails are open and will be groomed as of now. But connecting trails between Health Units will be closed?. They don't want yah travelling, but you can fly to destinations for the holidays. When we come out of lockdown, game on, unless your health unit is in the red or orange. Then no connecting trails still, and stay the home?. Right?. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTC Posted December 23, 2020 Share Posted December 23, 2020 Going to be tough for us, as our club is split right in the middle of 2 different health units 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tricky Posted December 23, 2020 Share Posted December 23, 2020 3 minutes ago, Muskoka Bill said: Based on my understanding and if lockdowns don't change then you should be able to go assuming the locals including the Health region director have not Mandated a restriction and you do the social distancing ... stuff. The decision becomes a moral one of traveling from a locked down region to a non locked down region. I have not seen anything that say's I can't travel at this time. In bold is the real crux of this confusion for sledders. The facts are: 1) The Premier has gone out of his way to allow snowmobiling in his open/closed list. 2) The overwhelming number of snowmobilers in Ontario live were you must trailer to snowmobile. 3) He then begs us to immediately start staying home. Anybody see a problem? Doug Ford , for months, has been sucking and blowing at the same time. Not all of us can do that, but I don't blame him. He said Monday that he wouldn't compromise our health to keep things open, just a couple hours after his paid experts said that every day without a lockdown is causing hundreds of C-19 hospital admissions. Of course he will compromise - that's a significant part of his job. He is trying his damnedest to balance the needs of the health care system with the needs of the economy and wants of the voters. We can be very happy that we aren't being governed by the Liberals or NDP, but we can't turn on each other as sledders. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vooodooo Posted December 23, 2020 Share Posted December 23, 2020 (edited) On 12/21/2020 at 7:38 AM, FROSTYNUTZ said: Even if sledders want to unlawfully ride the trails, they will be breaking laws by opening locked gates, and I cann,t imagine how crappy the trails would be, with zero grooming. And then consider the liability issues. NOT GOING TO BE A GOOD WINTER FOR HONEST LAW ABIDING SLEDDERS. That is what really bothers me. We have installed gates in many spots on our trail system. Usually to keep out ATV's and trucks. Sometimes to keep sleds out. The gates get opened as the trail is ready. the farmers crops won't be hurt. IMO, pulling out the bolt cutters, getting the wrenches out to disconnect the gate, or cut the fence is on par with break and enter. I've seen it many times. It really hinders grooming operations. As we decide what gets groomed before opening, we now have to decide what disrespectful sledders may do. It puts all of us at a disadvantage. We don't pack and/or groom sections that ass hats might F us over. Edited December 23, 2020 by vooodooo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoney Posted December 23, 2020 Share Posted December 23, 2020 7 minutes ago, GTC said: Going to be tough for us, as our club is split right in the middle of 2 different health units Exactly.....but what is advertised or communicated will be more in line with what the recommendations are. We are talking about trails that run through a bush, hydro corridors, logging roads, farm land, etc..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muskoka Bill Posted December 23, 2020 Share Posted December 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, tricky said: In bold is the real crux of this confusion for sledders. The facts are: 1) The Premier has gone out of his way to allow snowmobiling in his open/closed list. 2) The overwhelming number of snowmobilers in Ontario live were you must trailer to snowmobile. 3) He then begs us to immediately start staying home. Anybody see a problem? Doug Ford , for months, has been sucking and blowing at the same time. Not all of us can do that, but I don't blame him. He said Monday that he wouldn't compromise our health to keep things open, just a couple hours after his paid experts said that every day without a lockdown is causing hundreds of C-19 hospital admissions. Of course he will compromise - that's a significant part of his job. He is trying his damnedest to balance the needs of the health care system with the needs of the economy and wants of the voters. We can be very happy that we aren't being governed by the Liberals or NDP, but we can't turn on each other as sledders. It would be a political death wish for a politician to mandate a travel ban (and enforce it) so they are leaving it up the Health regions to mandate restrictions. People are protesting over wearing a mask for Christ sake how would they react to an enforced travel ban. It is the impossible enforcement given the designation of essential and non essential classification of work the province has implemented. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoney Posted December 23, 2020 Share Posted December 23, 2020 10 minutes ago, tricky said: In bold is the real crux of this confusion for sledders. The facts are: 1) The Premier has gone out of his way to allow snowmobiling in his open/closed list. 2) The overwhelming number of snowmobilers in Ontario live were you must trailer to snowmobile. 3) He then begs us to immediately start staying home. Anybody see a problem? Doug Ford , for months, has been sucking and blowing at the same time. Not all of us can do that, but I don't blame him. He said Monday that he wouldn't compromise our health to keep things open, just a couple hours after his paid experts said that every day without a lockdown is causing hundreds of C-19 hospital admissions. Of course he will compromise - that's a significant part of his job. He is trying his damnedest to balance the needs of the health care system with the needs of the economy and wants of the voters. We can be very happy that we aren't being governed by the Liberals or NDP, but we can't turn on each other as sledders. Agreed 100% that it is a very fine line and a double edge sword that he is navigating.... On one hand he is trying to curb the spread based on what is "best", listening to the various parties, various doctors, health specialists, hospital capacities (that is affecting other health needs), etc......, but understand that we as a society need to continue to live our lives, conduct business, etc...and as a Western society, we inherently do not agree with being told what to do, when or how, which under the Liberal regime has increased a fair amount the past decade. Some say too bad, suck it up, do not be selfish, look what people gave up in the past, etc.....let the government dictate what is best for YOU, but that is not the platform we live in now or in the past nor do I want to in the future, it is finding the happy medium and risk management given what is happening. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoso Posted December 23, 2020 Share Posted December 23, 2020 On 12/21/2020 at 5:18 PM, Big Pussy said: Ford is a business man. Its all about letting the public spend as much money as possible before Christmas. If he really cared we would be locked down now. No, if he really cared there would be no lockdown and no business forced to close. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Pussy Posted December 23, 2020 Share Posted December 23, 2020 Internet police my a$$. If you stay in Cochrane, there are only 2 or maybe 3 places to stay. The police station is right across the road from JR's. Going either way out of town, they are going by the motels. When they see a rig parked there, it's like shooting fish in a barrel. They run the plate on the truck and/or trailer and see you live south of the French River and you are caught. What is the fine for this now ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbo Tim Posted December 23, 2020 Share Posted December 23, 2020 (edited) I am trying to be respectful of other people and trying to balance things. I live outside of Toronto in a small hamlet, but I am lumped into the region, so it is what it is. If I load up and drive to say NBay and ride for the day, and return that same day I don't see any big deal with that. I bring my lunch, get gas and carry on. I can book a hotel anywhere in Ont, or Canada for that matter and go travel on a whim, not that I would but I could. Gov't is in a tough spot, and I see both sides of the equation. As long as everyone is respectful and uses a mask and sanitizes, you should be ok. Edited December 23, 2020 by Turbo Tim 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbo Tim Posted December 23, 2020 Share Posted December 23, 2020 10 minutes ago, Big Pussy said: Internet police my a$$. If you stay in Cochrane, there are only 2 or maybe 3 places to stay. The police station is right across the road from JR's. Going either way out of town, they are going by the motels. When they see a rig parked there, it's like shooting fish in a barrel. They run the plate on the truck and/or trailer and see you live south of the French River and you are caught. What is the fine for this now ? What are you talking about, I travel across the province for work every week, are you going to fine me for staying in Sudbury, Cochrane...don't think so. There are no laws about travelling within the province, there are recommendations, not laws. Show me a law that says I can not travel and what the statute is....we are not under martial law last time I checked 2 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake G Posted December 23, 2020 Share Posted December 23, 2020 (edited) The authorities have not restricted road travel. The "advice / recommendations / strong urgings" are not a travel ban. The wording is that you "should not" travel, rather than you "shall not" travel. Not traveling is a pretty good idea in many or even most instances, but it is possible to travel without getting close to other people. If you decide to travel to go sledding, you might consider being quiet about it, lest you add to the furor and make things worse for everyone. The provincial government has said snowmobile trails are allowed to open. The ofsc has stated it's policy will be to deem as "unavailable" trails that connect health units regions with an unequal prevalance of covid. In other words ofsc is doing what it can, to restrict snowmobiling between regions. It is not within ofsc's mandate to control road travel, but they have made road travel "recommendations " consistent with the recommendations of health units and the province. Participate in road travel if you must, but make darn sure not to contract or spread Covid while doing so. Do not ride on unavailable trails, as per normal. Edited December 24, 2020 by Blake G 5 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muskoka Bill Posted December 24, 2020 Share Posted December 24, 2020 (edited) 31 minutes ago, Big Pussy said: Internet police my a$$. If you stay in Cochrane, there are only 2 or maybe 3 places to stay. The police station is right across the road from JR's. Going either way out of town, they are going by the motels. When they see a rig parked there, it's like shooting fish in a barrel. They run the plate on the truck and/or trailer and see you live south of the French River and you are caught. What is the fine for this now ? Not being disrespectful but can you show me where it says I can not travel to a Green area from a Red area by automobile outside the lockdown period. All I have seen is restrictions (enforceable) that say I can't have more then X people in an enclosed area, there are recommendations for non-essential travel. If you have a web site please share it with the forum. Edited December 24, 2020 by Muskoka Bill 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PISTON LAKE CRUISER Posted December 24, 2020 Share Posted December 24, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Strong Farmer said: Here's what the OFSC stated: Today’s announcement reinforced “that Ontarians should stay at home as much as possible to minimize transmission of the virus and prevent hospitals from becoming overwhelmed.” This means that during the shutdown, and when trails are in the Orange, Red or Grey Zones, trail riding will be local in keeping with public health restrictions. To facilitate this, the OFSC will implement Flex Trail options for local riding as and where appropriate. Check the Interactive Trail Guide before riding. Flex Trail options include trails within a public health region being available only for local residents. My take on this is that the local riding is only for orange, red and grey zones. When I look at the coloured zone maps for Ontario, I think Hornpayne & Dub ( even though they are in different health units), Hearst and most of the rest of the NCDN are in a green area so the above highlighted sentences would not apply to them. However the area to the west of Hornpayne and Dub would be in orange and therefore a local riding area. Edited December 24, 2020 by PISTON LAKE CRUISER 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoso Posted December 24, 2020 Share Posted December 24, 2020 9 minutes ago, Turbo Tim said: What are you talking about, I travel across the province for work every week, are you going to fine me for staying in Sudbury, Cochrane...don't think so. There are no laws about travelling within the province, there are recommendations, not laws. Show me a law that says I can not travel and what the statute is....we are not under martial law last time I checked I can show you the charter of rights affirming your right of mobility. Police have no business telling where and when I can travel. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tricky Posted December 24, 2020 Share Posted December 24, 2020 21 minutes ago, Big Pussy said: Internet police my a$$. If you stay in Cochrane, there are only 2 or maybe 3 places to stay. The police station is right across the road from JR's. Going either way out of town, they are going by the motels. When they see a rig parked there, it's like shooting fish in a barrel. They run the plate on the truck and/or trailer and see you live south of the French River and you are caught. What is the fine for this now ? Pretty sure that there is no provincial or even regional travel ban at this time. So nothing illegal about going to Cochrane. I believe that there were a few regional travel bans in the spring. I know there were a lot of city and town bylaws quickly enacted to reduce travel, but I don't think that any of the fines levied were ever paid, and likely won't be. I could be wrong on any of those scores. Would love to hear from someone who can accurately correct me. I want to travel for snowmobiling, but I don't want to break the law. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoney Posted December 24, 2020 Share Posted December 24, 2020 39 minutes ago, Blake G said: The authorities have not restricted road travel. The "advice / recommendations / strong urgings" are not a travel ban. The wording is that you should not travel, rather than you shall not travel. Not traveling is a pretty good idea in many or even most instances, but it is possible to travel without getting close to other people. If you decide to travel to go sledding, you might consider being quiet about it, lest you add to the furor and make things worse for everyone. The provincial government has said snowmobile trails are allowed to open. The ofsc has stated it's policy will be to deem as "unavailable" trails that connect health units regions with an unequal prevalance of covid. In other words ofsc is doing what it can, to restrict snowmobiling between regions. It is not within ofsc's mandate to control road travel, but they have made road travel "recommendations " consistent with the recommendations of health units and the province. Participate in road travel if you must, but make darn sure not to contract or spread Covid while doing so. Do not ride on unavailable trails, as per normal. If you have recently traveled to Powassan, Bonfield, Mattawa or Cochrane to enjoy some early season riding, you might not mention it on social media. Some sledders might think about changing their OC handle to "Don't ask, don't tell." LOL....just might be a very quiet winter season on the forums this year............. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skidooboy Posted December 24, 2020 Share Posted December 24, 2020 (edited) it is what it is. Ski Edited December 24, 2020 by skidooboy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ox Posted December 24, 2020 Share Posted December 24, 2020 2 hours ago, Big Pussy said: Internet police my a$$. If you stay in Cochrane, there are only 2 or maybe 3 places to stay. The police station is right across the road from JR's. Going either way out of town, they are going by the motels. When they see a rig parked there, it's like shooting fish in a barrel. They run the plate on the truck and/or trailer and see you live south of the French River and you are caught. What is the fine for this now ? Better be darned sure that the town council is on board with that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottyr Posted December 24, 2020 Share Posted December 24, 2020 5 hours ago, Big Pussy said: I don't see how traveling from Mitchell to Cochrane meets the lock down rules for NOT traveling from area to area. If you do this, then you are no better than the idiots in the GTA that go to each others houses and party etc. Although your intentions are good, you are breaking the rules like it or not. Locals in Cochrane could and should report you. If there is a law that says we cannot travel, then I will stay home. The Northern regions will not be in lockdown at that point and I live in a low risk area. I live with 2 RNs (wife and oldest daughter) and they both tell me that as long as I keep any/all interaction with people to an absolute minimum they dont see any issue with me going snowmobiling for a few days. I wear a mask and carry hand sanitizer with me everywhere I go. I am very self sufficient and if that means eating all my meals in my room, I am ok with that. As I said, I do not plan on steeping foot in any restaurants and I always wear gloves when touching gas pumps. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbo Doo Posted December 24, 2020 Share Posted December 24, 2020 3 hours ago, Blake G said: The authorities have not restricted road travel. The "advice / recommendations / strong urgings" are not a travel ban. The wording is that you "should not" travel, rather than you "shall not" travel. Not traveling is a pretty good idea in many or even most instances, but it is possible to travel without getting close to other people. If you decide to travel to go sledding, you might consider being quiet about it, lest you add to the furor and make things worse for everyone. The provincial government has said snowmobile trails are allowed to open. The ofsc has stated it's policy will be to deem as "unavailable" trails that connect health units regions with an unequal prevalance of covid. In other words ofsc is doing what it can, to restrict snowmobiling between regions. It is not within ofsc's mandate to control road travel, but they have made road travel "recommendations " consistent with the recommendations of health units and the province. Participate in road travel if you must, but make darn sure not to contract or spread Covid while doing so. Do not ride on unavailable trails, as per normal. Ahmen.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbo Doo Posted December 24, 2020 Share Posted December 24, 2020 4 minutes ago, scottyr said: If there is a law that says we cannot travel, then I will stay home. The Northern regions will not be in lockdown at that point and I live in a low risk area. I live with 2 RNs (wife and oldest daughter) and they both tell me that as long as I keep any/all interaction with people to an absolute minimum they dont see any issue with me going snowmobiling for a few days. I wear a mask and carry hand sanitizer with me everywhere I go. I am very self sufficient and if that means eating all my meals in my room, I am ok with that. As I said, I do not plan on steeping foot in any restaurants and I always wear gloves when touching gas pumps. Ahmen again.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTC Posted December 24, 2020 Share Posted December 24, 2020 Myself as a long term volunteer, I hope with the lack of snow and the covid restrictions, some of the newbies and Jerks will get out of the sport I am sick and tired of off trail BS, and the lack of respect volunteers and clubs get for the work they do. Maybe the OFSC and the lesters could get together, , buy some private land for their Off trail market, which is all you see on their mags anymore Sorry for the rant but I know Im not alone on this 4 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTC Posted December 24, 2020 Share Posted December 24, 2020 I get a real kick out of the guys and or gals that complain about losing their $200 for the permit if the trails dont open, I bought a spare belt for my sled today it was 244 plus tax I doubt i will get that back if trails dont open 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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