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Something new from Doo coming tomorrow


Turbo Doo

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Here it is, check it out .... 

 

Cut the paddles to 1.5"

Gearing equivalent to 146" Freeride 1.6" version

X package shocks and T-motion delete shims

42" front end kit

 

:icon_naughty:

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11 hours ago, Big Pussy said:

That is just an altitude kit to keep the engine at 165 HP.  If it is boosted at sea level, (170hp) the rods will just  break again and saw the engine in half.  Same thing happened on 2016.5 and later Viper engines.  Boost and BOOM.  This forced everyone with a turbo boner to buy a Sidewinder that was actually made for the torque.

Most of the guys around here have had good luck with their turbo Vipers!

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I bet those Turbo Vipers are 2014, 2015, and early 2016's before the onset of the rubber rods.  My buddy has a 2016.5 Viper and wanted a so called factory approved turbo kit but Kellys would not sell it.  They would not say why.  If you want a 2016.5 and later to stay together, you need to buy forged Carello rods and do a complete dis-assembly to change them.  Yes some guys with unlimited money did that.  Latter, people just bought a Sidewinder or a Thundercat.  Do some reading on TY if you don't believe me.

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I have to either laugh at this, or applaud the marketing genius.  According to the RHS of the image, a regular 850 Etech is 165hp a Sea level, but 125hp at 8,000 ft..which they show as a -25% / -40hp (ie. comparing the same sled at Sea and 8k ft)..

 

On the LHS of the image the 850 Etech Turbo is 165 hp at Sea Level, but still 165hp at 8,000 ft.. which they show as +25% / +40hp, but in reality it should be +0% / +0HP because it doesn't change from Sea Level to 8k ft. Of course that doesn't really sound very good, so instead they are now comparing the Turbo to the non-turbo at 8k ft, but it was a bit of a head scratcher at first..

 

image.png.e084557e3e9257f590585decde748391.png

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This is genius imo. Whenever a BIG engine debut happens it always goes into something to test in in first. Look at Chevy when they replaced the small block and the LS1. The LS1 was in development for years and it debuted in the Corvette only first, then the Camaro for two years. This is so owners can beat the snot out of them before they put the LS1 into the market that really matters for GM. Their trucks. The Vette LS1 was 97, the Camaro 98, the Trucks not until 99.

 

It makes perfect sense to see a similar arc here with the turbo two strokes for ski-doo and considering all the revo9lutionary talk from Doo over this I would think we are going to see a lot more turbo options coming soon in both 600 and 850 models. My guess is another 1000cc MachZ turbo two stroke in at 220hp is already in test mode and 850 turbo flat land sleds are being tested to their limits right now which really isn't about the turbo its about the limits of the fuel and the reliability needed to warranty them. This is why I said genius in my first comment they have developed some sort of rapid shift barometric controller to the turbo so Doo is onto something big here tech wise that is likely to improve performance, AND efficiency as they move forward.

 

Bravo fellas, C’t’au boutte!!!

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1 hour ago, paulslund said:

I have to either laugh at this, or applaud the marketing genius.  According to the RHS of the image, a regular 850 Etech is 165hp a Sea level, but 125hp at 8,000 ft..which they show as a -25% / -40hp (ie. comparing the same sled at Sea and 8k ft)..

 

On the LHS of the image the 850 Etech Turbo is 165 hp at Sea Level, but still 165hp at 8,000 ft.. which they show as +25% / +40hp, but in reality it should be +0% / +0HP because it doesn't change from Sea Level to 8k ft. Of course that doesn't really sound very good, so instead they are now comparing the Turbo to the non-turbo at 8k ft, but it was a bit of a head scratcher at first..

 

image.png.e084557e3e9257f590585decde748391.png

 

The sled doesn't make a dime's more power, it just doesn't start losing until 8K'.

Apparently a very small spool, and the pic sure looks small as well.

3% less air pressure / 1000' altitude change.

It's not quite linear tho - it's more like "compounded daily interest", and it's more like it loses 3% from 1000' ago. 

Not like there is no atmosphere beyond 33,000'.

 

Of course they are comparing to a N/A motor - that's the whole point.

 

This isn't that graph in HotRod showing that headers make 5hp more on a chart that makes it look like 20% more b/c the start the chart 80% of the way up the capacity like when we were kids.

 

 

.

Edited by Ox
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8 hours ago, Techdenis007 said:

Here it is, check it out .... 

 

Cut the paddles to 1.5"

Gearing equivalent to 146" Freeride 1.6" version

X package shocks and T-motion delete shims

42" front end kit

 

:icon_naughty:

I like your train of thought, but.... that's a lot of junk (165" track) hanging out back on the trails :mrgreen:

 

*Edited* - Or did I misinterpret your thought? :huh: 

Edited by MXZSlider
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5 hours ago, Ox said:

Of course they are comparing to a N/A motor - that's the whole point..

I know that's the whole point, but on the RHS of the graph, they compare the NA to the NA at different elevations and show the -40hp, then on the LHS they compare the turbo to the turbo at different elevations, but show +40hp even though the hp hasn't changed..because they've now changed the comparison

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Are you saying that they are double dipping in +40 on one side and -40 on the other - giving the impression of an 80hp difference?

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57 minutes ago, paulslund said:

I know that's the whole point, but on the RHS of the graph, they compare the NA to the NA at different elevations and show the -40hp, then on the LHS they compare the turbo to the turbo at different elevations, but show +40hp even though the hp hasn't changed..because they've now changed the comparison

All they are showing is the difference between the turbo 850 and the normal NA 850. Both make the same jam at sea level. At elevation the boosted 850 will always have the advantage.  The graph explains the turbo 850 will have 40 horses more at "elevation" then the NA 850. The Turbo 850 was developed for the guys buying summits, who want a factory turbo sled.... Only designed to keep power up at elevation.  Basically saying the boosted 850 is 165hp all day, any elevation, where as the NA 850 willl loose power as you go UP. Same as all other NA sleds..

Edited by TURBO DOO
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Smart move Doo.

 

The 850 E-Tec Turbo has a sensor intergraded in the CVT cover, this will take a reading in the CVT area when the heat is too high, this will send a signal to the ECM and set off a notification in the cluster. There are two levels of functions one is a belt overload condition and the other is a belt overheat condition.

Note:
You may see belt temp in the cluster if it’s selected (A) 

 
Belt overheat condition:

 If the belt temperature reaches 75 Celsius/167 Fahrenheit a message will appear BELT OVERHEAT + 2 beeps every 10 seconds and once the belt temperature becomes lower then 75 Celsius/167 Fahrenheit the message disappears. 

 
Belt overload condition:

If a critical condition is detected over 1 minute a message will display BELT OVERLOAD + 2 beeps every 15 seconds, if the rider reduces critical overload style of riding the message disappears.

If it’s still in a critical condition for over 10 minutes the BELT OVERLOAD appears + 2 beeps every 10 seconds, the message will not disappear until engine shutdown.
 
This will not reduce any power lost but will advise the rider to ease up to help save the belt.
 
This will also resister two codes in BUDS:

                                        Level 1 = P3311: Overload with Warning in the cluster
                                        Level 2 = P3312: Overload with Warning in the cluster but rider continue to run hard. 

 
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12 minutes ago, reevester said:

Smart move Doo.

 

The 850 E-Tec Turbo has a sensor intergraded in the CVT cover, this will take a reading in the CVT area when the heat is too high, this will send a signal to the ECM and set off a notification in the cluster. There are two levels of functions one is a belt overload condition and the other is a belt overheat condition.

Note:
You may see belt temp in the cluster if it’s selected (A) 

 
Belt overheat condition:

 If the belt temperature reaches 75 Celsius/167 Fahrenheit a message will appear BELT OVERHEAT + 2 beeps every 10 seconds and once the belt temperature becomes lower then 75 Celsius/167 Fahrenheit the message disappears. 

 
Belt overload condition:

If a critical condition is detected over 1 minute a message will display BELT OVERLOAD + 2 beeps every 15 seconds, if the rider reduces critical overload style of riding the message disappears.

If it’s still in a critical condition for over 10 minutes the BELT OVERLOAD appears + 2 beeps every 10 seconds, the message will not disappear until engine shutdown.
 
This will not reduce any power lost but will advise the rider to ease up to help save the belt.
 
This will also resister two codes in BUDS:

                                        Level 1 = P3311: Overload with Warning in the cluster
                                        Level 2 = P3312: Overload with Warning in the cluster but rider continue to run hard. 

 

Very cool

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1 hour ago, Ox said:

Are you saying that they are double dipping in +40 on one side and -40 on the other - giving the impression of an 80hp difference?

If you just read those parts, without realizing what they are actually saying, then that's the first impression I got.. 

 

I had to double check to realize it's not +40hp at 8k ft above Sea Level, even though the RHS equivalent is saying -40 at 8k ft above Sea Level..  a quick view of both sides can make you think it's +40 above Sea Level.

 

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31 minutes ago, reevester said:

Smart move Doo.

 

The 850 E-Tec Turbo has a sensor intergraded in the CVT cover, this will take a reading in the CVT area when the heat is too high, this will send a signal to the ECM and set off a notification in the cluster. There are two levels of functions one is a belt overload condition and the other is a belt overheat condition.

Note:
You may see belt temp in the cluster if it’s selected (A) 

 
Belt overheat condition:

 If the belt temperature reaches 75 Celsius/167 Fahrenheit a message will appear BELT OVERHEAT + 2 beeps every 10 seconds and once the belt temperature becomes lower then 75 Celsius/167 Fahrenheit the message disappears. 

 
Belt overload condition:

If a critical condition is detected over 1 minute a message will display BELT OVERLOAD + 2 beeps every 15 seconds, if the rider reduces critical overload style of riding the message disappears.

If it’s still in a critical condition for over 10 minutes the BELT OVERLOAD appears + 2 beeps every 10 seconds, the message will not disappear until engine shutdown.
 
This will not reduce any power lost but will advise the rider to ease up to help save the belt.
 
This will also resister two codes in BUDS:

                                        Level 1 = P3311: Overload with Warning in the cluster
                                        Level 2 = P3312: Overload with Warning in the cluster but rider continue to run hard. 

 

That warning is gonna be ping'n like mad w/the "Send It/Hold my Beer" crowd in the province ... 

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As with much advertising we are bombarded with there can be more than one interpretation of what the presented information means. I'm pretty sure that the advertising guru's at Ski Doo understand that fact and are very OK with it. The gear heads will see and understand what is being presented. The less mechanically inclined will read the information and each one will determine what they believe the information is telling them. That may mean that some readers will believe they will be getting 80 hp. more out of the turbo version and yet have no idea what a turbo actually does.

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17 minutes ago, MXZSlider said:

That warning is gonna be ping'n like mad w/the "Send It/Hold my Beer" crowd in the province ... 

I'm sure all the ones in the mountains will see that code several times a day. 

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40 minutes ago, PISTON LAKE CRUISER said:

As with much advertising we are bombarded with there can be more than one interpretation of what the presented information means. I'm pretty sure that the advertising guru's at Ski Doo understand that fact and are very OK with it. The gear heads will see and understand what is being presented. The less mechanically inclined will read the information and each one will determine what they believe the information is telling them. That may mean that some readers will believe they will be getting 80 hp. more out of the turbo version and yet have no idea what a turbo actually does.

Well, I for one understood it right away - once I hit pause a few times through the very fast paced video.

At first I was really happy that they felt that this motor was solid enough to put boost to. Not that I want a huffer on my sled, but that it would seem that the motor should last a long time without one.

I just rode >11,000' last week and I'm content with what I have.

I've watched a blown RX1 go shooting (literally catching air) over the top many years ago, and I don't need to doo that. 

I don't need the expense of that. I don't need the complexity of that.

I want to be able to make it to the top, and play on the other side, but speed means very little to me.

That 3" track - now THAT'S the ticket baby!

 

I need to figger out a LH throttle for it yet tho.

I'm missin' that...

 

 

.

Edited by Ox
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37 minutes ago, reevester said:

I'm sure all the ones in the mountains will see that code several times a day. 

 

Not hardly. I had snow over my CRT (read-out (gauges?)) all day. 

Couldn't read a bloody thing.

I'm not sure that you are gunna hear a beep while you are in it hard enough to doo what it is that is causing the concern?

Edited by Ox
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11 minutes ago, Ox said:

 

Not hardly. I had snow over my CRT (read-out (guages?)) all day. 

Couldn't read a bloody thing.

I'm not sure that you are gunna hear a beep while you are in it hard enough to doo what it is that is causing the concern?

You'll hear it when your side panel comes popping off or the belt guard banging around in the cowl lol. 

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Great concept for the mountain guys as it slowly builds boost as you climb to keep the hp up..

If i was a doo guy I would stay with the 900 if I wanted a turbo sled and just get it tuned.

2 stroke turbo at sea level won’t hold up.

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1 hour ago, reevester said:

You'll hear it when your side panel comes popping off or the belt guard banging around in the cowl lol. 

Built in secondary alarm system... nuff said :D:D

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