2018 Toronto Sled Show

[Bigfish]

no you can not walk onto any private property and hunt, because you do not have an agreement with the owner to do so.

However OFSC has an agreement to use the private property, therefore you can use it.

as for proof of status, I have no problem producing it

[zoso]

7 minutes ago, Bigfish said:

here it is

https://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/010185

 

Look under exemptions (item 2 under section 4)

"No permit required on treaty or traditional lands"

 

In my case traditional lands is southern Ontario

Tyendinega? Oshwekan here, wife is from Tyendinega. however that becomes irrelevant as one could easily argue that your traditional lands were the entire province being it is an undefined term. Plus the cop, landowner or tril patrol cannot ask for prooof of status, so even a person that is not a member of a band and has no card can claim they self identify as native and ride on by. Basically being it does not state you must have a status card, then if your definition is the correct one, any person can self identify and ride for free. Do you think that is the spirit of the law? I can assure you it is not and you will lose in court.

[02Sled]

5 minutes ago, Bigfish said:

No it isn't

But when you make a blanket statement regarding a group of people of a particular race, or creed, it is racist.

When you make a blanket statement of a group of people based on their occupation, it is not!

 

see the difference

My blanket statement is regarding a group of people who receive preferential treatment financially and entitlement wise from provincial and federal governments. Go ahead and try to deny that preferential treatment apart from the rest of the population doesn't exist.

[zoso]

3 minutes ago, Bigfish said:

no you can not walk onto any private property and hunt, because you do not have an agreement with the owner to do so.

However OFSC has an agreement to use the private property, therefore you can use it.

as for proof of status, I have no problem producing it

That agreement is for permitted sleds only. take a look at the rest of the exemptions, it says the same,  for trapper, no mention of crown land either. So you are saying trappers can cross private property, they cannot, we all know that.

 

While engaged in trapping activities within the trapping area, or while travelling directly to or from the trapping area, if the trail is the only access route from the closest road to the trapping area or is the only safe access route to the trapping area.

[zoso]

6 minutes ago, Bigfish said:

no you can not walk onto any private property and hunt, because you do not have an agreement with the owner to do so.

However OFSC has an agreement to use the private property, therefore you can use it.

as for proof of status, I have no problem producing it

Great you can produce it but it not needed in the law. Just saying it is enough.

[zoso]

land owner handbook from OFSC.

 

 

Limited exemptions were reconfirmed for land owners and their tenants and immediate family members of both while on their own land, and extended to include while either is travelling directly to or from their property on Crown land, if the trail is the only access route from the closest road or is the only safe access route. The same exemption for Crown land only applies to Crown land tenants and their immediate family members. A Crown land exemption was granted to the Aboriginal people of Canada. A limited exemption on Crown land only is available to specific anglers and hunters who can prove that they are using their snowmobile while engaged in their sport, and when the trail on Crown land is the only access route from the closest road or is the only safe access route. For complete details on trail permit exemptions, please refer to Ontario Regulation 185/01 of the Motorized Snow Vehicles Act. It is important to understand that these exemptions do not apply to a snowmobile trail on private land, except for the specific owner of that land. As always, anyone other than the owner and family who wishes to enter or use private land must first obtain permission from the landowner.

[Bigfish]

7 minutes ago, 02Sled said:

My blanket statement is regarding a group of people who receive preferential treatment financially and entitlement wise from provincial and federal governments. Go ahead and try to deny that preferential treatment apart from the rest of the population doesn't exist.

as i said before you need to do some research into treaties, before you make these uninformed comments

6 minutes ago, zoso said:

That agreement is for permitted sleds only. take a look at the rest of the exemptions, it says the same,  for trapper, no mention of crown land either. So you are saying trappers can cross private property, they cannot, we all know that.

 

While engaged in trapping activities within the trapping area, or while travelling directly to or from the trapping area, if the trail is the only access route from the closest road to the trapping area or is the only safe access route to the trapping area.

https://www.ofah.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Snowmobile-exemptions-for-hunters-anglers-and-trappers.pdf

 

Crown Land is mentioned in conjunction with trappers 

2 minutes ago, zoso said:

Great you can produce it but it not needed in the law. Just saying it is enough.

I know, but I choose not have a confrontation on the trail

( its a Mohawk vs Ojibwe thing)

[zoso]

9 minutes ago, 02Sled said:

My blanket statement is regarding a group of people who receive preferential treatment financially and entitlement wise from provincial and federal governments. Go ahead and try to deny that preferential treatment apart from the rest of the population doesn't exist.

If a native in Canada cannot find success in life it is all on them. We have so many advantages over everyone else they outweigh any disadvantage. If you were born in Killarney would you stay they and languish when there is little economic opportunity or would you move to where you can work and prosper. You would move taking with you student debt. A has free post secondary education including housing, and has no excuse for not advancing forward in our society. Like I said, leadership is the failure here, they want poverty, they thrive on it and it is their bread and butter. Sure live on reserve tax free and even own a home there if you live in a reserve where economic opportunity exists, but if you live on a remote reserve, lookm around and see your future and decide if you want to be on welfare your entire life or have a life, up to you.

[zoso]

3 minutes ago, Bigfish said:

as i said before you need to do some research into treaties, before you make these uninformed comments

https://www.ofah.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Snowmobile-exemptions-for-hunters-anglers-and-trappers.pdf

 

Crown Land is mentioned in conjunction with trappers 

I know, but I choose not have a confrontation on the trail

( its a Mohawk vs Ojibwe thing)

Says the same thing about all exemptions. Crown land only.

[Bigfish]

1 minute ago, zoso said:

Says the same thing about all exemptions. Crown land only.

No mention of crown land in the definition I provided, so can we agree to disagree?

Moot point anyway for me, as I buy a permit annually

[zoso]

Just now, Bigfish said:

No mention of crown land in the definition I provided, so can we agree to disagree?

Moot point anyway for me, as I buy a permit annually

No mention od crown in the MSVA about trappers either. the definition you provided is not the MSVA, read it, no mention of crown lands. Your take on this is way off base, not what the law intends and reeks of entitlement. I too buy permits because I have to in order to ride legally, otherwise I may not, just like I took the 13k to send my kid to school, why pay when the government will pay for me, even though our income is close to 200k per year I sit here getting free things because I am being paid for something that never happened to me done by people long dead paid by many that whom's family was not even on this continent until recently. The entire indian issue needs to be resolved with a one time payout to individuals. A vote should be taken and see where it goes, then ammend the Indian Act to allow it.

[02Sled]

36 minutes ago, Bigfish said:

as i said before you need to do some research into treaties, before you make these uninformed comments

https://www.ofah.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Snowmobile-exemptions-for-hunters-anglers-and-trappers.pdf

 

Crown Land is mentioned in conjunction with trappers 

I know, but I choose not have a confrontation on the trail

( its a Mohawk vs Ojibwe thing)

Sorry but I don't need to do any more research into treaties to KNOW that aboriginals receive financial exemptions and preferential treatment that is not afforded the rest of society.

[sledjunk]

4 hours ago, Blake G said:

I will be at the show this morning for the opening. Look for the good-looking fellow with the black OC hat and matching back belt.

You will be beside him?

[Canuck]

27 minutes ago, sledjunk said:

You will be beside him?

 

Good one, SJ.

 

I had this image of Johnny Cash, a.k.a  Blake. 

 

I'm heading down to the Powersprts show Sunday a.m. Anyone want to meet at Zet's restaurant on Airport road at 9 am? Powersports show starts at 10. 

 

 

[snapper]

20 hours ago, 02Sled said:

What have you got for a quad. I was looking at the 400 and the 500. The 400 has a smaller chassis, most noticeably a shorter wheel base. There is only 2 inches difference in the ground clearance. John suggests that the 400 would meet my needs as I'm not going to be quick on the trails in our area. I know I won't want to do the 2 up that the 500 offers.

O2 , I tried out both the 400 & 500 CFMoto ATV’s . I ended up going with the 500 as I noticed the torque difference. Also nice to have the aluminum wheels,winch, and EPS. As far as Rosseau Rd. Powersports goes their sales and service is top notch. The Park family and their dedication to their business is appreciated as businesses like this are few and far between.

[02Sled]

24 minutes ago, snapper said:

O2 , I tried out both the 400 & 500 CFMoto ATV’s . I ended up going with the 500 as I noticed the torque difference. Also nice to have the aluminum wheels,winch, and EPS. As far as Rosseau Rd. Powersports goes their sales and service is top notch. The Park family and their dedication to their business is appreciated as businesses like this are few and far between.

Thanks for the insight on the two ATV's. I'm still on the fence about getting one or not. John explained there are two different chassis and the smaller of the two which is a shorter wheel base and only 2 inches difference on ground clearance can be had with both the 400 and 500 engines. The 500 they had at the show has the larger chassis. Which chassis did you go with? I anticipate I'll need to go for a test drive.

 

No need to sell me on Wild Bill and the rest of his family. He and John take care of our sleds for us and I took a friend of mine up to Bill to buy his side by side. He earned my loyalty years ago. Good service at a price that's fair to me and fair to him as well as not being sold work I don't need.

[Turbo Doo]

Just got back from the show. Was a nice way to spend a Saturday.  Great chatting with Nunz and Karen. Spent most of my time talking to the northern corridor du nord  boys. I thought the remote operated throttle for getting a sled unstuck was neat,  and also noticed qualipeices selling their ice scratchers mountable to a modified bottom front shock bolt mount this year. ( similar to what Denis007 did to his).   Picked up all the ofsc and quebec maps, and as always enjoyed the time with my good buddy 14Snow.  Great way to do the unofficial start to  the season..

 

Next Saturday.. Doo dealer..

[matt17]

1 hour ago, IQ TURBO said:

Just got back from the show. Was a nice way to spend a Saturday.  Great chatting with Nunz and Karen. Spent most of my time talking to the northern corridor du nord  boys. I thought the remote operated throttle for getting a sled unstuck was neat,  and also noticed qualipeices selling their ice scratchers mountable to a modified bottom front shock bolt mount this year. ( similar to what Denis007 did to his).   Picked up all the ofsc and quebec maps, and as always enjoyed the time with my good buddy 14Snow.  Great way to do the unofficial start to  the season..

 

Next Saturday.. Doo dealer..

Who was there from NCDN, wasn't sure who was going this year.  

 

[Turbo Doo]

18 minutes ago, matt17 said:

Who was there from NCDN, wasn't sure who was going this year.  

 

Matt, i can not remember the fellows names, but they are there each year. We spent some time chatting about the Hearst, Longlac - Geraldton area and down your way. It was good talking to the guys. Always enjoy our annual chat. 

[snapper]

13 hours ago, 02Sled said:

Thanks for the insight on the two ATV's. I'm still on the fence about getting one or not. John explained there are two different chassis and the smaller of the two which is a shorter wheel base and only 2 inches difference on ground clearance can be had with both the 400 and 500 engines. The 500 they had at the show has the larger chassis. Which chassis did you go with? I anticipate I'll need to go for a test drive.

 

No need to sell me on Wild Bill and the rest of his family. He and John take care of our sleds for us and I took a friend of mine up to Bill to buy his side by side. He earned my loyalty years ago. Good service at a price that's fair to me and fair to him as well as not being sold work I don't need.

O2, I went with the bigger chassis, which is the 2-up model. I went with that model because on the odd occasion I might have to have a passenger. Also legally you can not have a passenger on a 1up machine. If it wasn’t for that I would of went with the smaller chassis unit.

[revrnd]

Ran into a chap that I knew of from my work days. I had no idea that he was a sledder.

 

Looked for a 'doo jacket but nothing that I could see was a deal at FR's display. 399 bucks for a supposedly non-current jacket? I wonder what list was?

[johnsazzr]

23 hours ago, 02Sled said:

Sorry but I don't need to do any more research into treaties to KNOW that aboriginals receive financial exemptions and preferential treatment that is not afforded the rest of society.

true dat...Have lived on reserves in Ontario and Sask and had extensive experience in many Band finances from my work Banking experience...and MANY professional highly educated native clients ....they have their own system/rules at all levels including no HST, free education blah blah blah...

[PISTON LAKE CRUISER]

Hey, did anyone notice the new sled finance offer at one of the booths in the Yamaha /Polaris area. It was offering $44.00 per week financing for a new sled over 10 years. 

[Blake G]

Had an enjoyable 4 1/2 hours at the show yesterday. (Got to the door at 9:55. There was a line of about fifty people. I was inside the show area at 10:04. Next time I'll try to arrive at 10:05 to avoid the line.)

 

Spoke with lots of sledding acquaintances and friends.

 

Bought a Garmin inReach Explorer+ satellite messenger, for those inevitable days when I'll be riding alone beyond cell service. $522 plus tax (Nunz got one at Cabella's for $499). From what I can see, the basic freedom subscription plan is about $25 per year, plus $15 per activated month (USD). Allows for two way texting or email messaging. Thinking it will cost less than $200 Canadian a year for the sledding season. An overdue purchase.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[RotaxMike]

1 hour ago, Blake G said:

Had an enjoyable 4 1/2 hours at the show yesterday. (Got to the door at 9:55. There was a line of about fifty people. I was inside the show area at 10:04. Next time I'll try to arrive at 10:05 to avoid the line.)

 

Spoke with lots of sledding acquaintances and friends.

 

Bought a Garmin inReach Explorer+ satellite messenger, for those inevitable days when I'll be riding alone beyond cell service. $522 plus tax (Nunz got one at Cabella's for $499). From what I can see, the basic freedom subscription plan is about $25 per year, plus $15 per activated month (USD). Allows for two way texting or email messaging. Thinking it will cost less than $200 Canadian a year for the sledding season. An overdue purchase.

 

Also bought an all aluminum 16 x 7 enclosed single axle trailer from Action Trailers, at a "show special" price. I was planning on buying a Triton TC167, but went with a newly designed model called "ProStarr Bullet". Seems to be very well built; whether it's equal to a Triton remains to be seen. 

 

The chief advantage for my purposes is the smaller front profile. The cargo area inside height is 4 inches less than the TC167 , and the floor is 3 inches closer to the ground. A little tight while working inside the trailer, but less wind resistance while hauling with my SUV, or old Ram. The second Bullet advantage is the front swing-up door, which doesn't exist on the TC167.

 

 

 

 

I did the same thing as you Blake. I was going to the show to work out a deal on a triton 167, then I seen this trailer. The quality is amazing for the price. the things that are better then the tritan was everything is aluminum, handles, hinges, stainless pins. all hinges have grease fittings, frt door. the fenders are reinforced so you can stand on them to help clean the snow off the roof. The floor is marine plywood, which triton has but all the other brands have press board. The biggest difference is the price tag. It is $3000-4000 cheaper then the triton 167. I feel this is the same or even better built trailer.  The people I talked to at action trailers were great, not pushy & had no problem with helping you out.  This trailer is built a lot better then other brands & nobody is close to there price. The sales guys & the owner were great, maybe a big reason why they were selling & all the other brand were only talking. By the end of the show I would think around 100 of this model were ordered. I ordered mine with brakes. I saved almost $4000 over the triton, cant wait to get it.