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Trails Opening-Interactive guide


rockerdan

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If that is the case it should be pubblicized so that some of the idiots that don't stay to the stake lines can see the consequences and maybe just maybe learn

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Once again azzhats running off trails that ruin it for everybody now! thanks you clowns!

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Once again azzhats running off trails that ruin it for everybody now! thanks you clowns!

 

same happened in Elmvale last year. Even when the trail closed signs and barriers went up people ignored it likely ensuring little or no chance of getting access back

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After the late start this year it will be a gong show here in the muskokas when the trails first open

The asshats will be in full force

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I heard the farmer became tired of sledders riding on his property outside the staked trail.

This will be the downfall of our trails. Ignorant people not giving a crap...

Hey I have a bright idea, lets loosen the trail patrol and Stop programs and do away with enforcement....

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This will be the downfall of our trails. Ignorant people not giving a crap...

Hey I have a bright idea, lets loosen the trail patrol and Stop programs and do away with enforcement....

 

Great idea... or how about we make the trail permit voluntary.... make a donation amount of your choice. Something like the poppy boxes you see in stores. Every year some asshat steals a few of the poppy boxes.

 

We need more enforcement, stiffer penalties and what are we doing... the opposite. :wtf:

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Yup couldn't agree more! Im thinking on stopping into OFSC after work and asking them for couple trespass charge notice forms. Would like to see the look on their face when I ask for them lol.

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I know this will sound a little far fetched...maybe not. What about trail cams at points where sleds need to slow down crossing bigger rds or where there are intersections on the trails. Like the ones where the billboard trail maps are and lots of sleds stop. Somewhere you could catch a shot of sleds without permits. Hopefully be able to get the registration #s and be able to lay trespass charges that way. ?? If nothing else you've got a photo of trespassers and lots of them are locals usually, not the guys that dr 4 hrs to ride.... most likey not at least. Post the photos in local papers and online media and for sure someone will recognize the sleds and operators.

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Yup couldn't agree more! Im thinking on stopping into OFSC after work and asking them for couple trespass charge notice forms. Would like to see the look on their face when I ask for them lol.

They cant stop clubs from writing up a trespass notice. As an individual acting on behalf of the landowner, we are the acting agents.... If the landowner says charge them, we have too.....

Now selling permits on trail is another story, MTO doesnt want it happening anymore. We heard that arguement at convention....

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I know this will sound a little far fetched...maybe not. What about trail cams at points where sleds need to slow down crossing bigger rds or where there are intersections on the trails. Like the ones where the billboard trail maps are and lots of sleds stop. Somewhere you could catch a shot of sleds without permits. Hopefully be able to get the registration #s and be able to lay trespass charges that way. ?? If nothing else you've got a photo of trespassers and lots of them are locals usually, not the guys that dr 4 hrs to ride.... most likey not at least. Post the photos in local papers and online media and for sure someone will recognize the sleds and operators.

 

I've mentioned the idea of posting pictures of sleds and their riders on the trails without permits on social media and never gotten much of a response either way. Personally I think peer pressure would work wonders. I agree. It is not likely the guy who has trailered hours to ride. The sense I get is it is mainly locals riding mid week with little chance of getting caught or weekend cottagers who ride from the cottage.

 

When you see a group of sleds coming toward someone with a TP vest on suddenly turn around and race off the opposite direction what do you think the reason is.

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They cant stop clubs from writing up a trespass notice. As an individual acting on behalf of the landowner, we are the acting agents.... If the landowner says charge them, we have too.....

Now selling permits on trail is another story, MTO doesnt want it happening anymore. We heard that arguement at convention....

 

and the argument against it was?

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They cant stop clubs from writing up a trespass notice. As an individual acting on behalf of the landowner, we are the acting agents.... If the landowner says charge them, we have too.....

Now selling permits on trail is another story, MTO doesnt want it happening anymore. We heard that arguement at convention....

Yes I know they can't stop us from laying the trespass notice/charges. Which is why I am making it a point of taking a couple books of notices from them an voicing again the need and importance of enforcement and NOT just the walmart greeter!

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and the argument against it was?

 

They cant stop clubs from writing up a trespass notice. As an individual acting on behalf of the landowner, we are the acting agents.... If the landowner says charge them, we have too.....

Now selling permits on trail is another story, MTO doesnt want it happening anymore. We heard that arguement at convention....

selling passes on the trail is not a good idea...our local atv club did that and what happens is guys run the trails and if they get caught they then say: " I was hoping to run into a warden to get a pass".or say " we heard you could just buy passes on the trail"......guys would run trails countless times and never run into a warden....

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Yes I know they can't stop us from laying the trespass notice/charges. Which is why I am making it a point of taking a couple books of notices from them an voicing again the need and importance of enforcement and NOT just the walmart greeter!

 

the evolution seems to be taking us to the point of... we would really appreciate it if you would buy a permit, here's a trail map and have a nice day. Then they laugh as they ride away. If what I hear is true the permits will soon be available online only. My money says that will only help to increase the number of people who don't buy a permit. I know lots of people that if not for their kids needing it for school wouldn't have internet access at home. Myself I use it for banking and the sled forum. I have it at home for my job which my employer pays for. If I didn't need it for work I likely wouldn't have it at home just for banking and the forum.

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Getting photos is the hard part. Trail cams could do that job when they think no one is looking. Lots of deer hunters are sledders and lots use trail cams. I don't think it would take a half dozen or less captured shots, charges laid and being posted before violators seize to trespass.

I'm not the only bitter person that's waiting patiently WITH permit, valid insurance etc that's been paid out and waiting (big bucks for new sled to have a reliable nice ride to go north for longer periods) for more kms of connecting trails to open and ride instead of going 3 hrs to run up and down one trail a few times in a day to ride early. These (presumably) locals live right next to these trails and won't spend 180$ in October to ride out their back door.??? Cant afford it??? Can't get insurance cuz of too many dui's and speeding tickets???? I say TOO BAD so sad you can't enjoy some of life's privileges and luxuries. I know that's not always the case but I know a lot of it is. I hear it all the time from the guys that are the goons and why they don't have their ducks in order. Big breath! Rant over. Smiling on the outside! Lol

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and the argument against it was?

MTO wants strictly online sales due to accountability. The Permit is a MTO document. Too much cash going through volunteer hands. Frankly I welcome the online only next year.. Relieves alot of volunteer time and vendor duties.

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MTO wants strictly online sales due to accountability. The Permit is a MTO document. Too much cash going through volunteer hands. Frankly I welcome the online only next year.. Relieves alot of volunteer time and vendor duties.

 

I realize the online relieves the volunteer time but believe online only is a ridiculous expectation that everyone has that ability. Now if they made them available through the Ontario Services offices as well that I would agree with. Following MTO logic why don't they make the val tags for your cars and trucks online only. You can do it online today but not everyone likes that approach and prefers to pay in person. Also some may find it hard to believe in todays world but there are people without credit cards. Those with poor credit history, discharged bankruptcies who can't get a credit card and some like a friend of mine who as a condition of getting a mortgage wasn't allowed a credit card as that represented potential debt and the mortgage company had him at max debt load.

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I realize the online relieves the volunteer time but believe online only is a ridiculous expectation that everyone has that ability. Now if they made them available through the Ontario Services offices as well that I would agree with.

Its being investigated.

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The reason they are doing this is that they lost a section of the 88 trail when it crosses Aspidin road, there will be about 6km of road running this season. When the lake is staked the 88 will be lake access. They are using the Park and ride as a staging area.

I've been going to the monthly club meetings with them the past few months

That is not good at all, use this all the time, especially early and late season give our location on Vernon

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I realize the online relieves the volunteer time but believe online only is a ridiculous expectation that everyone has that ability. Now if they made them available through the Ontario Services offices as well that I would agree with. Following MTO logic why don't they make the val tags for your cars and trucks online only. You can do it online today but not everyone likes that approach and prefers to pay in person. Also some may find it hard to believe in todays world but there are people without credit cards. Those with poor credit history, discharged bankruptcies who can't get a credit card and some like a friend of mine who as a condition of getting a mortgage wasn't allowed a credit card as that represented potential debt and the mortgage company had him at max debt load.

Are those people stuck in the 80's? :)

It's 2016.

There's free internet access everywhere, and prepaid credit cards at every corner convenience store.

Anything that streamlines operations is a win in my book.

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Are those people stuck in the 80's? :)

It's 2016.

There's free internet access everywhere, and prepaid credit cards at every corner convenience store.

Anything that streamlines operations is a win in my book.

Not everybody is you. Not everybody is addicted to having the latest greatest mobbile phone or lives in an urban centre with that free wifi you taalk about. Not everyone walks down the street head down texting friends. Are you really so sure that the guy living in Orrville MacTier Kearney Sprucedale or any of those small towns have places with free wifi which is assuming they have the mobile device to access it.

Let's close down Service Ontario since you can renew plates or even get new ones online yet everyday they are full of people.

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Personally I am a fan of online sales but have a problem with online only for the reason stated above. I am also skeptical about the online only push is being pushed by MTO. I would like to see some evidence that MTO wants online only.

What has been lost in the discussion is the cost of online sales. I have seen estimates that online sales will cost in the area of $600k his year. So that's the cost of taking that workload away from the club volunteers that did that work previously and mostly for free. If clubs have been able to convert that volunteer capacity into other productive work then it might be worth it. My guess is that most of that volunteer capacity has been lost so the fulfilment fees become a net drag on the system.

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As of 2013 91% of Canadians had accessed the Internet. The highest access in the world.

2012 it was 83% so I suspect the 2014 and 2015 numbers would be up as well.

I would also suspect the 9% of Canadians who haven't accessed the Internet are likely towards the end of their lives or possibly just staring them.

I can't see how it makes sense to make permits available to the literal handful of people who dont or won't access the net.

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Are those people stuck in the 80's? :)

It's 2016.

There's free internet access everywhere, and prepaid credit cards at every corner convenience store.

Anything that streamlines operations is a win in my book.

whats wrong with still  living still in the 80'?? ..lol...guys who live by our camp have brutal internet service at best...not even cell phone service...need to go about 35 minutes drive to get free wi fi...I know guys who have been stopped on trails and when no pass is seen or found they give the: my internet was down, " printer out of ink so could not print temp pass, etc, etc, etc...,.bottom line is regardless of what systems are in place you will get dishonest people trying to screw the system...fine them $500 plus impound sled and perhaps things may change but I doubt it.

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As of 2013 91% of Canadians had accessed the Internet. The highest access in the world.

2012 it was 83% so I suspect the 2014 and 2015 numbers would be up as well.

I would also suspect the 9% of Canadians who haven't accessed the Internet are likely towards the end of their lives or possibly just staring them.

I can't see how it makes sense to make permits available to the literal handful of people who dont or won't access the net.

Because people have accessed the internet, does not mean that they purchase over the internet.  There are a number of people who do not trust using their credit cards online.

 

By the OFSC's statistics, something like 83% of permits were bought online, but that still leaves 17% that were not.

 

The last two years, our club's direct sales for the month of November outpaced the online sales for the month by almost 3 to 1.  These are the sales of permits after November 1 and before December 2.

 

I agree that the permit sales are a huge burden on volunteers, but I also agree with Big Pete when he said that that volunteer capacity is likely lost as opposed to being converted.

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