theedge Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Thats right WB. Being stopped and held up for checking all paperwork is not appreciated here either. A simple slow down to check for permit and lic. sticker should suffice. We have been stopped in Orillia while on a weeks trip,yes all had bags on and a favorite is stopping families on a Sunday afternoon for no reason. Meanwhile the idiots are screaming through the bush trails . These guys are hard to catch when your hiding behind a tree at the edge of a road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishhit Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 Look at it this way. If you get told at werk to check every pressure valve on the boiler you do it. Same for the cops. YOUR DIRECTIVE IS YOUR JOB! Its not the front lines fault. We all go to werk and pretty much without fault do as we are told or we don't werk! I agree that being stopped for roadside checks or trailside checks is somewhat of an infringement on our right to ride, they are the price paid for the privilege of riding. Get a grip on it and have a good attitude and things will be aight. Just be aware the werkin stiffs just have jobs to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJG Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 I believe common sense should prevail with a lot of sledders in regard to speed limit Ride within your capability and respect the other sledders on the trails. Zero tolerance for people without permits. Cant thank the volunteers enough for their time and dedication to the sport. My two cents. Have a great week folks. TJG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoso Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 I have been riding sleds since 1969, the days of no helmets, and I have never once gotten fined for anything sled related. Riding over 100,000 miles and never getting a ticket, can it really be that bad out there when it comes to enforcement? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muskoka_Mike Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 I was stopped once this weekend near Mactier. It was at the end of a trail that a lot of people can go fast on. I think the cop was doing radar as he ran from out of the bush to stop us. I drove up to him and he checked my pass and validation tag, and told us to move on. Didn't even have to turn off the engine. It was very quick and not an inconvenience at all. I did find the Police officer to be a little rude, though, as I stopped about 3 feet in front of him when he pointed at me and told me to drive the extra three feet so he did not have to walk that distance to see my validation tag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revrnd Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 I did find the Police officer to be a little rude, though, as I stopped about 3 feet in front of him when he pointed at me and told me to drive the extra three feet so he did not have to walk that distance to see my validation tag. Years ago we got written up for "not having registration numbers". Our 4 sleds had custom legible numbers (made legal the following season). It was a miserably cold day (also in MacTier where the trail crosses the tracks). The lead cop (2 cops, 2 auxiliaries) seemed to be in a bad mood that day. Afterwards 1 of my buddies wondered why. I said he probably wished he was on 69 in his cruiser. That being said, pretty much all the other cops I've dealt w/ were decent. I chatted w/ a couple of in Whitney 1 day. They asked about condition of the trails & seemed to be fairly personable. I've also asked guys a question (after the stop) & they were glad to answer. Yes they're doing the job their supervisors tell them to, but having trail stops (w/ the obligatory paperwork check) 10 minutes apart on the railbed thru Bancroft is stupid. Probably does more harm to any goodwill between the sledding public & the OPP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 Years ago we got written up for "not having registration numbers". Our 4 sleds had custom legible numbers (made legal the following season). It was a miserably cold day (also in MacTier where the trail crosses the tracks). The lead cop (2 cops, 2 auxiliaries) seemed to be in a bad mood that day. Afterwards 1 of my buddies wondered why. I said he probably wished he was on 69 in his cruiser. That being said, pretty much all the other cops I've dealt w/ were decent. I chatted w/ a couple of in Whitney 1 day. They asked about condition of the trails & seemed to be fairly personable. I've also asked guys a question (after the stop) & they were glad to answer. Yes they're doing the job their supervisors tell them to, but having trail stops w/ the obligatory paperwork check) 10 minutes apart on the railbed thru Bancroft is stupid. Probably does more harm to any goodwill between the sledding public & the OPP. definitely more harm than good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Techdenis007 Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 We were stopped yesterday on the trail by 3 STOP and one OPP in a paperwork / pass / pipe check, had a little chat with them and I made a point of thanking them for what they do. If they catch one dickhead without a pass, or without insurance, great, if not they at least made their presence felt. More trailside checks are needed in my area, preferably unannounced, and at more strategic locations. They were on a straight stretch with good visibility (for their safety I'm sure) but I think they should set up between the town and the trailer park at the West end, where they'd nail all the fockers with the cans on their sleds. A sled is a motor vehicle like any other, you have to be legal at all times. I've got no problem getting checked for papers and permits, though I agree twice on the same straight stretch is exaggerating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedy Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 Got stopped again this weekend up in Barry's Bay. Again, they were very pleasant guys but again, were looking for more than the visible registration stuff and wanted insurance, ownerships etc... I really don't get it. Don't they have to bust your taillight for probably cause before they start demanding your papers? I like the cops but I wish they were doing more stuff to make the trails safer and more enjoyable like nailing the idiots doing 120 around blind corners and by all means bust every fool that fails to buy a trail permit yet seems to enjoy riding them. I now have 296 miles on my sled and have been pulled over three times for paperwork checks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revrnd Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 Got stopped again this weekend up in Barry's Bay. Again, they were very pleasant guys but again, were looking for more than the visible registration stuff and wanted insurance, ownerships etc... I really don't get it. Don't they have to bust your taillight for probably cause before they start demanding your papers? I like the cops but I wish they were doing more stuff to make the trails safer and more enjoyable like nailing the idiots doing 120 around blind corners and by all means bust every fool that fails to buy a trail permit yet seems to enjoy riding them. I now have 296 miles on my sled and have been pulled over three times for paperwork checks. That only happens when you get pulled over by a sheriff's deputy in South Carolina or Georgia. That sucks that you've been thru 3 stops all ready this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roweboat70 Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 Guys, let me give you a perspective from someone that is part of STOP. I can only speak about how my group operates. 99% of the time, we are doing a 20 second check. We typically point at everything we are checking for.. 1. Trail Permit, 2. Registration #'s, 3. Val tag or license sticker, 4. Helmet strap if visable, give them the thumbs up and tell them to ride safe and to continue on. Sometimes the guys have already shut their machines off and are getting their stuff out and we are telling them to keep moving. On a typical day, we might see 200-250 sleds, of those we might check the paperwork of 10%, and even if we check paperwork, if they have it handy, I can do it in 1 minute. Depending on the circumstances, sometimes we will go to a 2nd level check, 1. Drivers licence, 2. Ownership, 3, Insurance. You would be surprised at the number of times that their drivers license is suspended, no insurance, ownership still in the previous owners name. Just on Sunday, we recovered a stolen sled, never would have known unless we asked for his paperwork. I'm a sledder and put on 4000-5000kms a year and I completely agree there needs to be better co-ordination between Police, OFSC trail patrol and STOP, so that checkpoints are spreadout. The challenge is that during the course of a day and 225kms, I can sled thru 3 OFSC districts, 4 OPP regions and 7 club areas. My experience so far has been that most sledders will take the time to tell us they appreciate us being out there, many sledders take the time to have a smoke break or ask us questions about the trails, or just shoot the breeze for 5-10mins, even after we have waved them through. We have zero tolorence for no trail permit and can's or modified exhausts. All the STOP guys and OPP that I work with are sledders and they want everyone to enjoy a safe day out on the trails, not delay you or hassle you. Once again thats the group that I work with... you run into all types out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 Got stopped again this weekend up in Barry's Bay. Again, they were very pleasant guys but again, were looking for more than the visible registration stuff and wanted insurance, ownerships etc... I really don't get it. Don't they have to bust your taillight for probably cause before they start demanding your papers? I like the cops but I wish they were doing more stuff to make the trails safer and more enjoyable like nailing the idiots doing 120 around blind corners and by all means bust every fool that fails to buy a trail permit yet seems to enjoy riding them. I now have 296 miles on my sled and have been pulled over three times for paperwork checks. If all the stickers are in place should be a pass thru like a ride check Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 Guys, let me give you a perspective from someone that is part of STOP. I can only speak about how my group operates. 99% of the time, we are doing a 20 second check. We typically point at everything we are checking for.. 1. Trail Permit, 2. Registration #'s, 3. Val tag or license sticker, 4. Helmet strap if visable, give them the thumbs up and tell them to ride safe and to continue on. Sometimes the guys have already shut their machines off and are getting their stuff out and we are telling them to keep moving. On a typical day, we might see 200-250 sleds, of those we might check the paperwork of 10%, and even if we check paperwork, if they have it handy, I can do it in 1 minute. Depending on the circumstances, sometimes we will go to a 2nd level check, 1. Drivers licence, 2. Ownership, 3, Insurance. You would be surprised at the number of times that their drivers license is suspended, no insurance, ownership still in the previous owners name. Just on Sunday, we recovered a stolen sled, never would have known unless we asked for his paperwork. I'm a sledder and put on 4000-5000kms a year and I completely agree there needs to be better co-ordination between Police, OFSC trail patrol and STOP, so that checkpoints are spreadout. The challenge is that during the course of a day and 225kms, I can sled thru 3 OFSC districts, 4 OPP regions and 7 club areas. My experience so far has been that most sledders will take the time to tell us they appreciate us being out there, many sledders take the time to have a smoke break or ask us questions about the trails, or just shoot the breeze for 5-10mins, even after we have waved them through. We have zero tolorence for no trail permit and can's or modified exhausts. All the STOP guys and OPP that I work with are sledders and they want everyone to enjoy a safe day out on the trails, not delay you or hassle you. Once again thats the group that I work with... you run into all types out there. so what triggers a second level check Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasquatch777 Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 The big difference is that on a snowmobile trail they are stopping and checking every sled in many cases although in some locations they do wave you through if they see a valid Trail Permit. There have been many reports of a snowmobiler being subject to the same check more than once per day. On the highway, they almost always pull a vehicle over for some perceived infraction, not to check that you actually have a Driver's Licence and Insurance and valid Vehicle Registration. How many times have you seen them stopping every vehicle on a highway and doing a complete paper check and keep everybody in line until they finish checking the one first in line. The answer is never. Why are snowmobilers subject to full Monty? Hmm lets see! How many posts on here complaining that the police are not out in full force checking permits? How many posts are not putting the OPP in a good light because the poster thinks the Police are not doing their job ie checking for permits? Sometimes you have to be careful what you ask for! There is more then sledders without permits that can ruin sledding! Overbearing police state on the trails is another. Remember people you asked, no demanded they be there! Did anyone really think the only thing they would check is trail permits? Papers Please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 Hmm lets see! How many posts on here complaining that the police are not out in full force checking permits? How many posts are not putting the OPP in a good light because the poster thinks the Police are not doing their job ie checking for permits? Sometimes you have to be careful what you ask for! There is more then sledders without permits that can ruin sledding! Overbearing police state on the trails is another. Remember people you asked, no demanded they be there! Did anyone really think the only thing they would check is trail permits? Papers Please! They are on the highways and do not paper us all the damn time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasquatch777 Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 50 is too much on some trails and too slow on others. Most of the places I have seen the OPP with radar they have used some common sense and only really get concerned when the speed is way over and likely beyond safe for the conditions. There are likely others though that are maybe more letter of the law. Speed limit is insane! No one goes 50k not even the president of the OFSC himself when he rode here. Manitoba is what is posted ie 80 to 100k and Saskatchewan is 80k. I cruise at what I'm used to and that is about 90 to 100k Trail permiting! Average speed on the GPS is usually 40 to 50kms, in Manitoba as high as 60kms. Luckily around here you only worry about speed when your near towns. The lakes, railbeds and powerlines are about double the posted limit! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasquatch777 Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 They are on the highways and do not paper us all the damn time Lets see this area has caught more stolen vehicles, kidnappers and other people running from the law then any other. Two reasons for that, they run the plates of all the vehicles then can and once they run them and get a hit the person has nowhere to run to. One highway in one out. Now they have a much harder time doing that with a snowmobile on a trail don't they! Add to that a whacky permit system that has no registry with the government so it becomes papers please and they go back to the car to run them. Again careful what you ask for, you might get it! You want the police to check permits they are along with everything else, you don't get to tell them just the permits please. They are only doing what they have been asked to do by the OFSC and most everyone on this forum. Get out on the trails and do their job! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02Sled Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 Speed limit is insane! No one goes 50k not even the president of the OFSC himself when he rode here. Manitoba is what is posted ie 80 to 100k and Saskatchewan is 80k. I cruise at what I'm used to and that is about 90 to 100k Trail permiting! Average speed on the GPS is usually 40 to 50kms, in Manitoba as high as 60kms. Luckily around here you only worry about speed when your near towns. The lakes, railbeds and powerlines are about double the posted limit! Like I said... some places 50 is too low and others too high. We have some twisting narrow trails through the trees where if you hit 25 you are doing good. You meet a sled coming the other way and you crawl past each other hoping you don't hook skis or one stops while the other sneaks past. Then you have the railbeds where obviously 50 is too low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domino Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 Guys, let me give you a perspective from someone that is part of STOP. I can only speak about how my group operates. 99% of the time, we are doing a 20 second check. We typically point at everything we are checking for.. 1. Trail Permit, 2. Registration #'s, 3. Val tag or license sticker, 4. Helmet strap if visable, give them the thumbs up and tell them to ride safe and to continue on. Sometimes the guys have already shut their machines off and are getting their stuff out and we are telling them to keep moving. On a typical day, we might see 200-250 sleds, of those we might check the paperwork of 10%, and even if we check paperwork, if they have it handy, I can do it in 1 minute. Depending on the circumstances, sometimes we will go to a 2nd level check, 1. Drivers licence, 2. Ownership, 3, Insurance. You would be surprised at the number of times that their drivers license is suspended, no insurance, ownership still in the previous owners name. Just on Sunday, we recovered a stolen sled, never would have known unless we asked for his paperwork. I'm a sledder and put on 4000-5000kms a year and I completely agree there needs to be better co-ordination between Police, OFSC trail patrol and STOP, so that checkpoints are spreadout. The challenge is that during the course of a day and 225kms, I can sled thru 3 OFSC districts, 4 OPP regions and 7 club areas. My experience so far has been that most sledders will take the time to tell us they appreciate us being out there, many sledders take the time to have a smoke break or ask us questions about the trails, or just shoot the breeze for 5-10mins, even after we have waved them through. We have zero tolorence for no trail permit and can's or modified exhausts. All the STOP guys and OPP that I work with are sledders and they want everyone to enjoy a safe day out on the trails, not delay you or hassle you. Once again thats the group that I work with... you run into all types out there. Good Post! It makes sense that the issue is in coordination so as to spread out more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasquatch777 Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Like I said... some places 50 is too low and others too high. We have some twisting narrow trails through the trees where if you hit 25 you are doing good. You meet a sled coming the other way and you crawl past each other hoping you don't hook skis or one stops while the other sneaks past. Then you have the railbeds where obviously 50 is too low. Using my GPS I find that our north trail gives about a 28MPH average. Now on that trail are a Power line and couple lakes. On the lakes we do 60 to 80 mph same as the powerline. Given that the distance we can do those speeds is say 20 to 25 miles out of 70 and our average is below 30 or 50K it points out that we go slow in the tight twisty's well below 50K. On the West trail things pick up because there is about 50 miles of lake to run and about 40 miles of trail. Average goes up to 40mph again showing that even though on the lake we are cruising in the trails we slow way down. Our luck here is the Police don't radar patrol the trails except for around town and that is a good thing. Our death rate for sleds is extremely low and if it where not for alcohol it would be 0. I don't mind speed its the idiots that hog the inside of every corner or run down the middle of the trail and won't get over. Another reason I like to ride at night is because I can see the lights of other oncoming sleds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Good Post! It makes sense that the issue is in coordination so as to spread out more. the problem is that they all like traffic counts and the seguin gets them traffic counts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02Sled Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Using my GPS I find that our north trail gives about a 28MPH average. Now on that trail are a Power line and couple lakes. On the lakes we do 60 to 80 mph same as the powerline. Given that the distance we can do those speeds is say 20 to 25 miles out of 70 and our average is below 30 or 50K it points out that we go slow in the tight twisty's well below 50K. On the West trail things pick up because there is about 50 miles of lake to run and about 40 miles of trail. Average goes up to 40mph again showing that even though on the lake we are cruising in the trails we slow way down. Our luck here is the Police don't radar patrol the trails except for around town and that is a good thing. Our death rate for sleds is extremely low and if it where not for alcohol it would be 0. I don't mind speed its the idiots that hog the inside of every corner or run down the middle of the trail and won't get over. Another reason I like to ride at night is because I can see the lights of other oncoming sleds. That is likely the biggest concern... I really don't have a problem with anyone who is riding in control and not coming around the bend on my side of the trail or decides to try and pass on a bend only to find they are coming head on at someone coming the other way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lastzrt Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Did a nice 100 mile loop run up the Bruce Pen. on Saturday with my buddy from Wiarton. Coming back into Wiarton we met four OPP at the three way intersection across the hwy. from the OPP detachment One officer ran over to do a quick visual check for permits and tags/numbers, he thanked us for stopping and waved us on. Had anything visually not been in order, I am sure the paperwork would have been thoroughly checked out. That's the way to do it, and I appreciate their presence on the trail checking for compliance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbill Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Did a nice 100 mile loop run up the Bruce Pen. on Saturday with my buddy from Wiarton. Coming back into Wiarton we met four OPP at the three way intersection across the hwy. from the OPP detachment One officer ran over to do a quick visual check for permits and tags/numbers, he thanked us for stopping and waved us on. Had anything visually not been in order, I am sure the paperwork would have been thoroughly checked out. That's the way to do it, and I appreciate their presence on the trail checking for compliance. perfect as it should be glad you had a good ride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yammydoo Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 they are nothing but a pain.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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